Wouldn't Matt Smith be the 12th Doctor and not the 11th because David Tennant is both 10 and 11?












13














How is Matt Smith not the 12th Doctor (since David Tennant regenerated first into himself and then into Matt Smith)? Then wouldn't Peter Capaldi be the 13th Doctor? (Because that regeneration was a gift from the Time Lords thanks to Clara.)










share|improve this question









New contributor




smelborp is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
















  • 6




    And it's more complicated than that, due to the existence of the Valeyard.
    – Spencer
    Dec 29 '18 at 17:21






  • 5




    And the War Doctor. :p
    – Longspeak
    Dec 30 '18 at 3:20






  • 1




    What about the war doctor played by John hurt? If you count his regeneration he should be 9th doctor, which screws up all numbers.
    – David S Podd
    Dec 30 '18 at 16:26
















13














How is Matt Smith not the 12th Doctor (since David Tennant regenerated first into himself and then into Matt Smith)? Then wouldn't Peter Capaldi be the 13th Doctor? (Because that regeneration was a gift from the Time Lords thanks to Clara.)










share|improve this question









New contributor




smelborp is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
















  • 6




    And it's more complicated than that, due to the existence of the Valeyard.
    – Spencer
    Dec 29 '18 at 17:21






  • 5




    And the War Doctor. :p
    – Longspeak
    Dec 30 '18 at 3:20






  • 1




    What about the war doctor played by John hurt? If you count his regeneration he should be 9th doctor, which screws up all numbers.
    – David S Podd
    Dec 30 '18 at 16:26














13












13








13







How is Matt Smith not the 12th Doctor (since David Tennant regenerated first into himself and then into Matt Smith)? Then wouldn't Peter Capaldi be the 13th Doctor? (Because that regeneration was a gift from the Time Lords thanks to Clara.)










share|improve this question









New contributor




smelborp is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.











How is Matt Smith not the 12th Doctor (since David Tennant regenerated first into himself and then into Matt Smith)? Then wouldn't Peter Capaldi be the 13th Doctor? (Because that regeneration was a gift from the Time Lords thanks to Clara.)







doctor-who regeneration






share|improve this question









New contributor




smelborp is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.











share|improve this question









New contributor




smelborp is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.









share|improve this question




share|improve this question








edited Dec 30 '18 at 18:07









Stormblessed

536119




536119






New contributor




smelborp is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.









asked Dec 29 '18 at 16:53









smelborp

6613




6613




New contributor




smelborp is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.





New contributor





smelborp is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.






smelborp is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.








  • 6




    And it's more complicated than that, due to the existence of the Valeyard.
    – Spencer
    Dec 29 '18 at 17:21






  • 5




    And the War Doctor. :p
    – Longspeak
    Dec 30 '18 at 3:20






  • 1




    What about the war doctor played by John hurt? If you count his regeneration he should be 9th doctor, which screws up all numbers.
    – David S Podd
    Dec 30 '18 at 16:26














  • 6




    And it's more complicated than that, due to the existence of the Valeyard.
    – Spencer
    Dec 29 '18 at 17:21






  • 5




    And the War Doctor. :p
    – Longspeak
    Dec 30 '18 at 3:20






  • 1




    What about the war doctor played by John hurt? If you count his regeneration he should be 9th doctor, which screws up all numbers.
    – David S Podd
    Dec 30 '18 at 16:26








6




6




And it's more complicated than that, due to the existence of the Valeyard.
– Spencer
Dec 29 '18 at 17:21




And it's more complicated than that, due to the existence of the Valeyard.
– Spencer
Dec 29 '18 at 17:21




5




5




And the War Doctor. :p
– Longspeak
Dec 30 '18 at 3:20




And the War Doctor. :p
– Longspeak
Dec 30 '18 at 3:20




1




1




What about the war doctor played by John hurt? If you count his regeneration he should be 9th doctor, which screws up all numbers.
– David S Podd
Dec 30 '18 at 16:26




What about the war doctor played by John hurt? If you count his regeneration he should be 9th doctor, which screws up all numbers.
– David S Podd
Dec 30 '18 at 16:26










6 Answers
6






active

oldest

votes


















20














Here's the "regeneration" you're referring to:








The key here is that, while the Doctor did use up one of his regenerations, he didn't actually regenerate. He used just enough of the regeneration energy to heal himself, then channelled the rest into his severed hand from "The Christmas Invasion", preventing himself from fully changing.



You can think of it like the scene in "Let's Kill Hitler" where River Song transfers the last of her regeneration energy into the Doctor to revive him: on both occasions, the energy brought him back to life, but he didn't regenerate. So he's still the Tenth Doctor.






share|improve this answer

















  • 2




    I’m fairly certain 12 discusses this with Pond at some point, mentioning his “vanity issues” at the time, and how this was his last form. I just wish I could remember the scene.
    – Eric McCormick
    Dec 31 '18 at 14:23










  • @EricMcCormick I think that was Eleven, discussing it with Clara during the Siege of Trenzalore.
    – F1Krazy
    Dec 31 '18 at 16:53










  • That sounds right, although I didn’t quickly find a clip on YouTube substantiating it. ¯_(ツ)_/¯
    – Eric McCormick
    Dec 31 '18 at 17:00





















17














It's complicated, more complicated than anyone knows exactly and this is why:



In the episode "The Brain of Morbeus" The Doctor faced a Timelord, a criminal mastermind who had survived execution called Morbeus. In a desperate attempt to thwart his plans, The Doctor goaded Morbeus into a mental duel.



They were both hooked to a machine which pitted all their mental resources from each of their many lives against the other's, their will and their knowledge and their determination to win, and to live.



The effort killed The Doctor, and reduced his enemy Morbeus to an insane gibbering wreck who threw himself off a cliff, so The Doctor - even in death won.



Whilst he was hooked up to the machine, The Doctor's and Morbeus's previous personas were displayed one by one as they were drawn into the contest - these images appeared among others:



enter image description here
Attribution: Peter 2018



None of the (lower row of) above images are of Doctors that we can pinpoint and name easily, they all appeared before the image of William Hartnell, Peter Cushing (had you forgotten him too? Here.) Michael Jayston (as per comments), David Bradley (Here) et al..



The Party line is that Peter Capaldi is the twelfth, but there's more to it, much more to it, perhaps more than even The Doctor himself knows - Rasillon knows, I don't.






share|improve this answer










New contributor




Duckisaduckisaduck is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.














  • 2




    Canonically, I'd expect that they're meant to be future versions considering that they're in a different colour with a sort of portally effect.
    – wizzwizz4
    Dec 29 '18 at 21:08










  • @wizzwizz4 Possibly, but their costumes appear to be from Earth's past - admittedly that's no guarantee of anything.
    – Duckisaduckisaduck
    Dec 30 '18 at 4:28








  • 1




    @Duckisaduckisaduck such linear thinking.
    – JAB
    Dec 31 '18 at 0:11






  • 1




    @JAB True, I need a Tardis, for educational purposes.
    – Duckisaduckisaduck
    Dec 31 '18 at 0:15












  • We certainly know by out of universe reasons that none of them can or will be future doctors on the show so this certainly complicates any numbering system based on regenerations.
    – The Great Duck
    Dec 31 '18 at 10:50





















4














Personally, I also thought that by regenerating into the "same" body, that ought to count as two separate Doctors. However, regardless of in-universe status, the numbering of the Doctors is really based on the out-of-universe actors who played the character. On that basis, since the actor did not change, the numbering of the Doctor did not change either.






share|improve this answer

















  • 1




    Given the fuss Ten made about changing into a new body at the end (you know, about dying and a new man walking away with his memories) and how easily this went over, I conclude he didn't really regenerate here.
    – Mr Lister
    Dec 30 '18 at 8:21



















4














Canonically, there only is, was, and will ever be one Doctor. The numbering is simply a referencing device for commentating on the show.






share|improve this answer








New contributor




Clarius is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.


















  • You've had my +1, the rest of the answers are just waffle, including mine.
    – Duckisaduckisaduck
    yesterday





















3














The numbers generally refer to the number of times the Doctor has regenerated, distinct from the number of times the Doctor has consumed one of his available regenrations.



In short, new face, new actor, new number.






share|improve this answer

















  • 1




    The first Doctor was not the doctor after the first regeneration, and the War Doctor is not in the numbering scheme and was a regeneration, so only 9th Doctor and the first regeneration of 10th Doctor have the same 'Doctor number' as the number of times the Doctor has regenerated. (bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/p01mj6k8/… 54:26 the 11th Doctor refers to "regeneration number 13")
    – Pete Kirkham
    Dec 30 '18 at 22:56



















0














There's another question on here that asks what "counts" as a regeneration - I've opined that it's not the amount of energy used, but the number of times the energy (and the process) is tapped into. The events of the show suggest they consider the rule to be the number of times the process is started.



This was all addressed in Matt Smith's last episode The Time of the Doctor. The War Doctor (played by John Hurt) was a regeneration The Doctor didn't acknowledge, but it certainly counted as a regeneration. So too did Ten's "partial" regeneration after getting hit by the Dalek beam. He chose to offload the regeneration energy into his severed hand. He retained the same body/regeneration, but the process was started, the energy was expended, so it too counted towards his twelve regeneration limit.



Moffat cannily hinted that the fans "had forgotten something" when it came to the regeneration limit, namely that Tennant regeneration. Comments online made it clear that damn near nobody forgot, and we were all keen to see what he was going to do, since by the rules, The Doctor had hit his limit.



So to answer the original question, Smith's regeneration indeed the twelfth regeneration, but the "extra" Doctor is The War Doctor. So technically, Eccleston was Ten, and Tennant was Eleven. They never "counted" the War Doctor, so Smith often referred to himself as "eleven", but he still counted as a regeneration.






share|improve this answer




















    protected by Community Dec 31 '18 at 7:21



    Thank you for your interest in this question.
    Because it has attracted low-quality or spam answers that had to be removed, posting an answer now requires 10 reputation on this site (the association bonus does not count).



    Would you like to answer one of these unanswered questions instead?














    6 Answers
    6






    active

    oldest

    votes








    6 Answers
    6






    active

    oldest

    votes









    active

    oldest

    votes






    active

    oldest

    votes









    20














    Here's the "regeneration" you're referring to:








    The key here is that, while the Doctor did use up one of his regenerations, he didn't actually regenerate. He used just enough of the regeneration energy to heal himself, then channelled the rest into his severed hand from "The Christmas Invasion", preventing himself from fully changing.



    You can think of it like the scene in "Let's Kill Hitler" where River Song transfers the last of her regeneration energy into the Doctor to revive him: on both occasions, the energy brought him back to life, but he didn't regenerate. So he's still the Tenth Doctor.






    share|improve this answer

















    • 2




      I’m fairly certain 12 discusses this with Pond at some point, mentioning his “vanity issues” at the time, and how this was his last form. I just wish I could remember the scene.
      – Eric McCormick
      Dec 31 '18 at 14:23










    • @EricMcCormick I think that was Eleven, discussing it with Clara during the Siege of Trenzalore.
      – F1Krazy
      Dec 31 '18 at 16:53










    • That sounds right, although I didn’t quickly find a clip on YouTube substantiating it. ¯_(ツ)_/¯
      – Eric McCormick
      Dec 31 '18 at 17:00


















    20














    Here's the "regeneration" you're referring to:








    The key here is that, while the Doctor did use up one of his regenerations, he didn't actually regenerate. He used just enough of the regeneration energy to heal himself, then channelled the rest into his severed hand from "The Christmas Invasion", preventing himself from fully changing.



    You can think of it like the scene in "Let's Kill Hitler" where River Song transfers the last of her regeneration energy into the Doctor to revive him: on both occasions, the energy brought him back to life, but he didn't regenerate. So he's still the Tenth Doctor.






    share|improve this answer

















    • 2




      I’m fairly certain 12 discusses this with Pond at some point, mentioning his “vanity issues” at the time, and how this was his last form. I just wish I could remember the scene.
      – Eric McCormick
      Dec 31 '18 at 14:23










    • @EricMcCormick I think that was Eleven, discussing it with Clara during the Siege of Trenzalore.
      – F1Krazy
      Dec 31 '18 at 16:53










    • That sounds right, although I didn’t quickly find a clip on YouTube substantiating it. ¯_(ツ)_/¯
      – Eric McCormick
      Dec 31 '18 at 17:00
















    20












    20








    20






    Here's the "regeneration" you're referring to:








    The key here is that, while the Doctor did use up one of his regenerations, he didn't actually regenerate. He used just enough of the regeneration energy to heal himself, then channelled the rest into his severed hand from "The Christmas Invasion", preventing himself from fully changing.



    You can think of it like the scene in "Let's Kill Hitler" where River Song transfers the last of her regeneration energy into the Doctor to revive him: on both occasions, the energy brought him back to life, but he didn't regenerate. So he's still the Tenth Doctor.






    share|improve this answer












    Here's the "regeneration" you're referring to:








    The key here is that, while the Doctor did use up one of his regenerations, he didn't actually regenerate. He used just enough of the regeneration energy to heal himself, then channelled the rest into his severed hand from "The Christmas Invasion", preventing himself from fully changing.



    You can think of it like the scene in "Let's Kill Hitler" where River Song transfers the last of her regeneration energy into the Doctor to revive him: on both occasions, the energy brought him back to life, but he didn't regenerate. So he's still the Tenth Doctor.















    share|improve this answer












    share|improve this answer



    share|improve this answer










    answered Dec 29 '18 at 17:59









    F1Krazy

    4,4081740




    4,4081740








    • 2




      I’m fairly certain 12 discusses this with Pond at some point, mentioning his “vanity issues” at the time, and how this was his last form. I just wish I could remember the scene.
      – Eric McCormick
      Dec 31 '18 at 14:23










    • @EricMcCormick I think that was Eleven, discussing it with Clara during the Siege of Trenzalore.
      – F1Krazy
      Dec 31 '18 at 16:53










    • That sounds right, although I didn’t quickly find a clip on YouTube substantiating it. ¯_(ツ)_/¯
      – Eric McCormick
      Dec 31 '18 at 17:00
















    • 2




      I’m fairly certain 12 discusses this with Pond at some point, mentioning his “vanity issues” at the time, and how this was his last form. I just wish I could remember the scene.
      – Eric McCormick
      Dec 31 '18 at 14:23










    • @EricMcCormick I think that was Eleven, discussing it with Clara during the Siege of Trenzalore.
      – F1Krazy
      Dec 31 '18 at 16:53










    • That sounds right, although I didn’t quickly find a clip on YouTube substantiating it. ¯_(ツ)_/¯
      – Eric McCormick
      Dec 31 '18 at 17:00










    2




    2




    I’m fairly certain 12 discusses this with Pond at some point, mentioning his “vanity issues” at the time, and how this was his last form. I just wish I could remember the scene.
    – Eric McCormick
    Dec 31 '18 at 14:23




    I’m fairly certain 12 discusses this with Pond at some point, mentioning his “vanity issues” at the time, and how this was his last form. I just wish I could remember the scene.
    – Eric McCormick
    Dec 31 '18 at 14:23












    @EricMcCormick I think that was Eleven, discussing it with Clara during the Siege of Trenzalore.
    – F1Krazy
    Dec 31 '18 at 16:53




    @EricMcCormick I think that was Eleven, discussing it with Clara during the Siege of Trenzalore.
    – F1Krazy
    Dec 31 '18 at 16:53












    That sounds right, although I didn’t quickly find a clip on YouTube substantiating it. ¯_(ツ)_/¯
    – Eric McCormick
    Dec 31 '18 at 17:00






    That sounds right, although I didn’t quickly find a clip on YouTube substantiating it. ¯_(ツ)_/¯
    – Eric McCormick
    Dec 31 '18 at 17:00















    17














    It's complicated, more complicated than anyone knows exactly and this is why:



    In the episode "The Brain of Morbeus" The Doctor faced a Timelord, a criminal mastermind who had survived execution called Morbeus. In a desperate attempt to thwart his plans, The Doctor goaded Morbeus into a mental duel.



    They were both hooked to a machine which pitted all their mental resources from each of their many lives against the other's, their will and their knowledge and their determination to win, and to live.



    The effort killed The Doctor, and reduced his enemy Morbeus to an insane gibbering wreck who threw himself off a cliff, so The Doctor - even in death won.



    Whilst he was hooked up to the machine, The Doctor's and Morbeus's previous personas were displayed one by one as they were drawn into the contest - these images appeared among others:



    enter image description here
    Attribution: Peter 2018



    None of the (lower row of) above images are of Doctors that we can pinpoint and name easily, they all appeared before the image of William Hartnell, Peter Cushing (had you forgotten him too? Here.) Michael Jayston (as per comments), David Bradley (Here) et al..



    The Party line is that Peter Capaldi is the twelfth, but there's more to it, much more to it, perhaps more than even The Doctor himself knows - Rasillon knows, I don't.






    share|improve this answer










    New contributor




    Duckisaduckisaduck is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
    Check out our Code of Conduct.














    • 2




      Canonically, I'd expect that they're meant to be future versions considering that they're in a different colour with a sort of portally effect.
      – wizzwizz4
      Dec 29 '18 at 21:08










    • @wizzwizz4 Possibly, but their costumes appear to be from Earth's past - admittedly that's no guarantee of anything.
      – Duckisaduckisaduck
      Dec 30 '18 at 4:28








    • 1




      @Duckisaduckisaduck such linear thinking.
      – JAB
      Dec 31 '18 at 0:11






    • 1




      @JAB True, I need a Tardis, for educational purposes.
      – Duckisaduckisaduck
      Dec 31 '18 at 0:15












    • We certainly know by out of universe reasons that none of them can or will be future doctors on the show so this certainly complicates any numbering system based on regenerations.
      – The Great Duck
      Dec 31 '18 at 10:50


















    17














    It's complicated, more complicated than anyone knows exactly and this is why:



    In the episode "The Brain of Morbeus" The Doctor faced a Timelord, a criminal mastermind who had survived execution called Morbeus. In a desperate attempt to thwart his plans, The Doctor goaded Morbeus into a mental duel.



    They were both hooked to a machine which pitted all their mental resources from each of their many lives against the other's, their will and their knowledge and their determination to win, and to live.



    The effort killed The Doctor, and reduced his enemy Morbeus to an insane gibbering wreck who threw himself off a cliff, so The Doctor - even in death won.



    Whilst he was hooked up to the machine, The Doctor's and Morbeus's previous personas were displayed one by one as they were drawn into the contest - these images appeared among others:



    enter image description here
    Attribution: Peter 2018



    None of the (lower row of) above images are of Doctors that we can pinpoint and name easily, they all appeared before the image of William Hartnell, Peter Cushing (had you forgotten him too? Here.) Michael Jayston (as per comments), David Bradley (Here) et al..



    The Party line is that Peter Capaldi is the twelfth, but there's more to it, much more to it, perhaps more than even The Doctor himself knows - Rasillon knows, I don't.






    share|improve this answer










    New contributor




    Duckisaduckisaduck is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
    Check out our Code of Conduct.














    • 2




      Canonically, I'd expect that they're meant to be future versions considering that they're in a different colour with a sort of portally effect.
      – wizzwizz4
      Dec 29 '18 at 21:08










    • @wizzwizz4 Possibly, but their costumes appear to be from Earth's past - admittedly that's no guarantee of anything.
      – Duckisaduckisaduck
      Dec 30 '18 at 4:28








    • 1




      @Duckisaduckisaduck such linear thinking.
      – JAB
      Dec 31 '18 at 0:11






    • 1




      @JAB True, I need a Tardis, for educational purposes.
      – Duckisaduckisaduck
      Dec 31 '18 at 0:15












    • We certainly know by out of universe reasons that none of them can or will be future doctors on the show so this certainly complicates any numbering system based on regenerations.
      – The Great Duck
      Dec 31 '18 at 10:50
















    17












    17








    17






    It's complicated, more complicated than anyone knows exactly and this is why:



    In the episode "The Brain of Morbeus" The Doctor faced a Timelord, a criminal mastermind who had survived execution called Morbeus. In a desperate attempt to thwart his plans, The Doctor goaded Morbeus into a mental duel.



    They were both hooked to a machine which pitted all their mental resources from each of their many lives against the other's, their will and their knowledge and their determination to win, and to live.



    The effort killed The Doctor, and reduced his enemy Morbeus to an insane gibbering wreck who threw himself off a cliff, so The Doctor - even in death won.



    Whilst he was hooked up to the machine, The Doctor's and Morbeus's previous personas were displayed one by one as they were drawn into the contest - these images appeared among others:



    enter image description here
    Attribution: Peter 2018



    None of the (lower row of) above images are of Doctors that we can pinpoint and name easily, they all appeared before the image of William Hartnell, Peter Cushing (had you forgotten him too? Here.) Michael Jayston (as per comments), David Bradley (Here) et al..



    The Party line is that Peter Capaldi is the twelfth, but there's more to it, much more to it, perhaps more than even The Doctor himself knows - Rasillon knows, I don't.






    share|improve this answer










    New contributor




    Duckisaduckisaduck is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
    Check out our Code of Conduct.









    It's complicated, more complicated than anyone knows exactly and this is why:



    In the episode "The Brain of Morbeus" The Doctor faced a Timelord, a criminal mastermind who had survived execution called Morbeus. In a desperate attempt to thwart his plans, The Doctor goaded Morbeus into a mental duel.



    They were both hooked to a machine which pitted all their mental resources from each of their many lives against the other's, their will and their knowledge and their determination to win, and to live.



    The effort killed The Doctor, and reduced his enemy Morbeus to an insane gibbering wreck who threw himself off a cliff, so The Doctor - even in death won.



    Whilst he was hooked up to the machine, The Doctor's and Morbeus's previous personas were displayed one by one as they were drawn into the contest - these images appeared among others:



    enter image description here
    Attribution: Peter 2018



    None of the (lower row of) above images are of Doctors that we can pinpoint and name easily, they all appeared before the image of William Hartnell, Peter Cushing (had you forgotten him too? Here.) Michael Jayston (as per comments), David Bradley (Here) et al..



    The Party line is that Peter Capaldi is the twelfth, but there's more to it, much more to it, perhaps more than even The Doctor himself knows - Rasillon knows, I don't.







    share|improve this answer










    New contributor




    Duckisaduckisaduck is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
    Check out our Code of Conduct.









    share|improve this answer



    share|improve this answer








    edited Dec 30 '18 at 4:35





















    New contributor




    Duckisaduckisaduck is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
    Check out our Code of Conduct.









    answered Dec 29 '18 at 17:37









    Duckisaduckisaduck

    2717




    2717




    New contributor




    Duckisaduckisaduck is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
    Check out our Code of Conduct.





    New contributor





    Duckisaduckisaduck is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
    Check out our Code of Conduct.






    Duckisaduckisaduck is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
    Check out our Code of Conduct.








    • 2




      Canonically, I'd expect that they're meant to be future versions considering that they're in a different colour with a sort of portally effect.
      – wizzwizz4
      Dec 29 '18 at 21:08










    • @wizzwizz4 Possibly, but their costumes appear to be from Earth's past - admittedly that's no guarantee of anything.
      – Duckisaduckisaduck
      Dec 30 '18 at 4:28








    • 1




      @Duckisaduckisaduck such linear thinking.
      – JAB
      Dec 31 '18 at 0:11






    • 1




      @JAB True, I need a Tardis, for educational purposes.
      – Duckisaduckisaduck
      Dec 31 '18 at 0:15












    • We certainly know by out of universe reasons that none of them can or will be future doctors on the show so this certainly complicates any numbering system based on regenerations.
      – The Great Duck
      Dec 31 '18 at 10:50
















    • 2




      Canonically, I'd expect that they're meant to be future versions considering that they're in a different colour with a sort of portally effect.
      – wizzwizz4
      Dec 29 '18 at 21:08










    • @wizzwizz4 Possibly, but their costumes appear to be from Earth's past - admittedly that's no guarantee of anything.
      – Duckisaduckisaduck
      Dec 30 '18 at 4:28








    • 1




      @Duckisaduckisaduck such linear thinking.
      – JAB
      Dec 31 '18 at 0:11






    • 1




      @JAB True, I need a Tardis, for educational purposes.
      – Duckisaduckisaduck
      Dec 31 '18 at 0:15












    • We certainly know by out of universe reasons that none of them can or will be future doctors on the show so this certainly complicates any numbering system based on regenerations.
      – The Great Duck
      Dec 31 '18 at 10:50










    2




    2




    Canonically, I'd expect that they're meant to be future versions considering that they're in a different colour with a sort of portally effect.
    – wizzwizz4
    Dec 29 '18 at 21:08




    Canonically, I'd expect that they're meant to be future versions considering that they're in a different colour with a sort of portally effect.
    – wizzwizz4
    Dec 29 '18 at 21:08












    @wizzwizz4 Possibly, but their costumes appear to be from Earth's past - admittedly that's no guarantee of anything.
    – Duckisaduckisaduck
    Dec 30 '18 at 4:28






    @wizzwizz4 Possibly, but their costumes appear to be from Earth's past - admittedly that's no guarantee of anything.
    – Duckisaduckisaduck
    Dec 30 '18 at 4:28






    1




    1




    @Duckisaduckisaduck such linear thinking.
    – JAB
    Dec 31 '18 at 0:11




    @Duckisaduckisaduck such linear thinking.
    – JAB
    Dec 31 '18 at 0:11




    1




    1




    @JAB True, I need a Tardis, for educational purposes.
    – Duckisaduckisaduck
    Dec 31 '18 at 0:15






    @JAB True, I need a Tardis, for educational purposes.
    – Duckisaduckisaduck
    Dec 31 '18 at 0:15














    We certainly know by out of universe reasons that none of them can or will be future doctors on the show so this certainly complicates any numbering system based on regenerations.
    – The Great Duck
    Dec 31 '18 at 10:50






    We certainly know by out of universe reasons that none of them can or will be future doctors on the show so this certainly complicates any numbering system based on regenerations.
    – The Great Duck
    Dec 31 '18 at 10:50













    4














    Personally, I also thought that by regenerating into the "same" body, that ought to count as two separate Doctors. However, regardless of in-universe status, the numbering of the Doctors is really based on the out-of-universe actors who played the character. On that basis, since the actor did not change, the numbering of the Doctor did not change either.






    share|improve this answer

















    • 1




      Given the fuss Ten made about changing into a new body at the end (you know, about dying and a new man walking away with his memories) and how easily this went over, I conclude he didn't really regenerate here.
      – Mr Lister
      Dec 30 '18 at 8:21
















    4














    Personally, I also thought that by regenerating into the "same" body, that ought to count as two separate Doctors. However, regardless of in-universe status, the numbering of the Doctors is really based on the out-of-universe actors who played the character. On that basis, since the actor did not change, the numbering of the Doctor did not change either.






    share|improve this answer

















    • 1




      Given the fuss Ten made about changing into a new body at the end (you know, about dying and a new man walking away with his memories) and how easily this went over, I conclude he didn't really regenerate here.
      – Mr Lister
      Dec 30 '18 at 8:21














    4












    4








    4






    Personally, I also thought that by regenerating into the "same" body, that ought to count as two separate Doctors. However, regardless of in-universe status, the numbering of the Doctors is really based on the out-of-universe actors who played the character. On that basis, since the actor did not change, the numbering of the Doctor did not change either.






    share|improve this answer












    Personally, I also thought that by regenerating into the "same" body, that ought to count as two separate Doctors. However, regardless of in-universe status, the numbering of the Doctors is really based on the out-of-universe actors who played the character. On that basis, since the actor did not change, the numbering of the Doctor did not change either.







    share|improve this answer












    share|improve this answer



    share|improve this answer










    answered Dec 29 '18 at 17:29









    Buzz

    34.5k6118190




    34.5k6118190








    • 1




      Given the fuss Ten made about changing into a new body at the end (you know, about dying and a new man walking away with his memories) and how easily this went over, I conclude he didn't really regenerate here.
      – Mr Lister
      Dec 30 '18 at 8:21














    • 1




      Given the fuss Ten made about changing into a new body at the end (you know, about dying and a new man walking away with his memories) and how easily this went over, I conclude he didn't really regenerate here.
      – Mr Lister
      Dec 30 '18 at 8:21








    1




    1




    Given the fuss Ten made about changing into a new body at the end (you know, about dying and a new man walking away with his memories) and how easily this went over, I conclude he didn't really regenerate here.
    – Mr Lister
    Dec 30 '18 at 8:21




    Given the fuss Ten made about changing into a new body at the end (you know, about dying and a new man walking away with his memories) and how easily this went over, I conclude he didn't really regenerate here.
    – Mr Lister
    Dec 30 '18 at 8:21











    4














    Canonically, there only is, was, and will ever be one Doctor. The numbering is simply a referencing device for commentating on the show.






    share|improve this answer








    New contributor




    Clarius is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
    Check out our Code of Conduct.


















    • You've had my +1, the rest of the answers are just waffle, including mine.
      – Duckisaduckisaduck
      yesterday


















    4














    Canonically, there only is, was, and will ever be one Doctor. The numbering is simply a referencing device for commentating on the show.






    share|improve this answer








    New contributor




    Clarius is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
    Check out our Code of Conduct.


















    • You've had my +1, the rest of the answers are just waffle, including mine.
      – Duckisaduckisaduck
      yesterday
















    4












    4








    4






    Canonically, there only is, was, and will ever be one Doctor. The numbering is simply a referencing device for commentating on the show.






    share|improve this answer








    New contributor




    Clarius is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
    Check out our Code of Conduct.









    Canonically, there only is, was, and will ever be one Doctor. The numbering is simply a referencing device for commentating on the show.







    share|improve this answer








    New contributor




    Clarius is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
    Check out our Code of Conduct.









    share|improve this answer



    share|improve this answer






    New contributor




    Clarius is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
    Check out our Code of Conduct.









    answered Dec 30 '18 at 7:27









    Clarius

    491




    491




    New contributor




    Clarius is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
    Check out our Code of Conduct.





    New contributor





    Clarius is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
    Check out our Code of Conduct.






    Clarius is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
    Check out our Code of Conduct.












    • You've had my +1, the rest of the answers are just waffle, including mine.
      – Duckisaduckisaduck
      yesterday




















    • You've had my +1, the rest of the answers are just waffle, including mine.
      – Duckisaduckisaduck
      yesterday


















    You've had my +1, the rest of the answers are just waffle, including mine.
    – Duckisaduckisaduck
    yesterday






    You've had my +1, the rest of the answers are just waffle, including mine.
    – Duckisaduckisaduck
    yesterday













    3














    The numbers generally refer to the number of times the Doctor has regenerated, distinct from the number of times the Doctor has consumed one of his available regenrations.



    In short, new face, new actor, new number.






    share|improve this answer

















    • 1




      The first Doctor was not the doctor after the first regeneration, and the War Doctor is not in the numbering scheme and was a regeneration, so only 9th Doctor and the first regeneration of 10th Doctor have the same 'Doctor number' as the number of times the Doctor has regenerated. (bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/p01mj6k8/… 54:26 the 11th Doctor refers to "regeneration number 13")
      – Pete Kirkham
      Dec 30 '18 at 22:56
















    3














    The numbers generally refer to the number of times the Doctor has regenerated, distinct from the number of times the Doctor has consumed one of his available regenrations.



    In short, new face, new actor, new number.






    share|improve this answer

















    • 1




      The first Doctor was not the doctor after the first regeneration, and the War Doctor is not in the numbering scheme and was a regeneration, so only 9th Doctor and the first regeneration of 10th Doctor have the same 'Doctor number' as the number of times the Doctor has regenerated. (bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/p01mj6k8/… 54:26 the 11th Doctor refers to "regeneration number 13")
      – Pete Kirkham
      Dec 30 '18 at 22:56














    3












    3








    3






    The numbers generally refer to the number of times the Doctor has regenerated, distinct from the number of times the Doctor has consumed one of his available regenrations.



    In short, new face, new actor, new number.






    share|improve this answer












    The numbers generally refer to the number of times the Doctor has regenerated, distinct from the number of times the Doctor has consumed one of his available regenrations.



    In short, new face, new actor, new number.







    share|improve this answer












    share|improve this answer



    share|improve this answer










    answered Dec 29 '18 at 17:58









    Stephen Collings

    3,35822140




    3,35822140








    • 1




      The first Doctor was not the doctor after the first regeneration, and the War Doctor is not in the numbering scheme and was a regeneration, so only 9th Doctor and the first regeneration of 10th Doctor have the same 'Doctor number' as the number of times the Doctor has regenerated. (bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/p01mj6k8/… 54:26 the 11th Doctor refers to "regeneration number 13")
      – Pete Kirkham
      Dec 30 '18 at 22:56














    • 1




      The first Doctor was not the doctor after the first regeneration, and the War Doctor is not in the numbering scheme and was a regeneration, so only 9th Doctor and the first regeneration of 10th Doctor have the same 'Doctor number' as the number of times the Doctor has regenerated. (bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/p01mj6k8/… 54:26 the 11th Doctor refers to "regeneration number 13")
      – Pete Kirkham
      Dec 30 '18 at 22:56








    1




    1




    The first Doctor was not the doctor after the first regeneration, and the War Doctor is not in the numbering scheme and was a regeneration, so only 9th Doctor and the first regeneration of 10th Doctor have the same 'Doctor number' as the number of times the Doctor has regenerated. (bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/p01mj6k8/… 54:26 the 11th Doctor refers to "regeneration number 13")
    – Pete Kirkham
    Dec 30 '18 at 22:56




    The first Doctor was not the doctor after the first regeneration, and the War Doctor is not in the numbering scheme and was a regeneration, so only 9th Doctor and the first regeneration of 10th Doctor have the same 'Doctor number' as the number of times the Doctor has regenerated. (bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/p01mj6k8/… 54:26 the 11th Doctor refers to "regeneration number 13")
    – Pete Kirkham
    Dec 30 '18 at 22:56











    0














    There's another question on here that asks what "counts" as a regeneration - I've opined that it's not the amount of energy used, but the number of times the energy (and the process) is tapped into. The events of the show suggest they consider the rule to be the number of times the process is started.



    This was all addressed in Matt Smith's last episode The Time of the Doctor. The War Doctor (played by John Hurt) was a regeneration The Doctor didn't acknowledge, but it certainly counted as a regeneration. So too did Ten's "partial" regeneration after getting hit by the Dalek beam. He chose to offload the regeneration energy into his severed hand. He retained the same body/regeneration, but the process was started, the energy was expended, so it too counted towards his twelve regeneration limit.



    Moffat cannily hinted that the fans "had forgotten something" when it came to the regeneration limit, namely that Tennant regeneration. Comments online made it clear that damn near nobody forgot, and we were all keen to see what he was going to do, since by the rules, The Doctor had hit his limit.



    So to answer the original question, Smith's regeneration indeed the twelfth regeneration, but the "extra" Doctor is The War Doctor. So technically, Eccleston was Ten, and Tennant was Eleven. They never "counted" the War Doctor, so Smith often referred to himself as "eleven", but he still counted as a regeneration.






    share|improve this answer


























      0














      There's another question on here that asks what "counts" as a regeneration - I've opined that it's not the amount of energy used, but the number of times the energy (and the process) is tapped into. The events of the show suggest they consider the rule to be the number of times the process is started.



      This was all addressed in Matt Smith's last episode The Time of the Doctor. The War Doctor (played by John Hurt) was a regeneration The Doctor didn't acknowledge, but it certainly counted as a regeneration. So too did Ten's "partial" regeneration after getting hit by the Dalek beam. He chose to offload the regeneration energy into his severed hand. He retained the same body/regeneration, but the process was started, the energy was expended, so it too counted towards his twelve regeneration limit.



      Moffat cannily hinted that the fans "had forgotten something" when it came to the regeneration limit, namely that Tennant regeneration. Comments online made it clear that damn near nobody forgot, and we were all keen to see what he was going to do, since by the rules, The Doctor had hit his limit.



      So to answer the original question, Smith's regeneration indeed the twelfth regeneration, but the "extra" Doctor is The War Doctor. So technically, Eccleston was Ten, and Tennant was Eleven. They never "counted" the War Doctor, so Smith often referred to himself as "eleven", but he still counted as a regeneration.






      share|improve this answer
























        0












        0








        0






        There's another question on here that asks what "counts" as a regeneration - I've opined that it's not the amount of energy used, but the number of times the energy (and the process) is tapped into. The events of the show suggest they consider the rule to be the number of times the process is started.



        This was all addressed in Matt Smith's last episode The Time of the Doctor. The War Doctor (played by John Hurt) was a regeneration The Doctor didn't acknowledge, but it certainly counted as a regeneration. So too did Ten's "partial" regeneration after getting hit by the Dalek beam. He chose to offload the regeneration energy into his severed hand. He retained the same body/regeneration, but the process was started, the energy was expended, so it too counted towards his twelve regeneration limit.



        Moffat cannily hinted that the fans "had forgotten something" when it came to the regeneration limit, namely that Tennant regeneration. Comments online made it clear that damn near nobody forgot, and we were all keen to see what he was going to do, since by the rules, The Doctor had hit his limit.



        So to answer the original question, Smith's regeneration indeed the twelfth regeneration, but the "extra" Doctor is The War Doctor. So technically, Eccleston was Ten, and Tennant was Eleven. They never "counted" the War Doctor, so Smith often referred to himself as "eleven", but he still counted as a regeneration.






        share|improve this answer












        There's another question on here that asks what "counts" as a regeneration - I've opined that it's not the amount of energy used, but the number of times the energy (and the process) is tapped into. The events of the show suggest they consider the rule to be the number of times the process is started.



        This was all addressed in Matt Smith's last episode The Time of the Doctor. The War Doctor (played by John Hurt) was a regeneration The Doctor didn't acknowledge, but it certainly counted as a regeneration. So too did Ten's "partial" regeneration after getting hit by the Dalek beam. He chose to offload the regeneration energy into his severed hand. He retained the same body/regeneration, but the process was started, the energy was expended, so it too counted towards his twelve regeneration limit.



        Moffat cannily hinted that the fans "had forgotten something" when it came to the regeneration limit, namely that Tennant regeneration. Comments online made it clear that damn near nobody forgot, and we were all keen to see what he was going to do, since by the rules, The Doctor had hit his limit.



        So to answer the original question, Smith's regeneration indeed the twelfth regeneration, but the "extra" Doctor is The War Doctor. So technically, Eccleston was Ten, and Tennant was Eleven. They never "counted" the War Doctor, so Smith often referred to himself as "eleven", but he still counted as a regeneration.







        share|improve this answer












        share|improve this answer



        share|improve this answer










        answered yesterday









        VBartilucci

        8,71211640




        8,71211640

















            protected by Community Dec 31 '18 at 7:21



            Thank you for your interest in this question.
            Because it has attracted low-quality or spam answers that had to be removed, posting an answer now requires 10 reputation on this site (the association bonus does not count).



            Would you like to answer one of these unanswered questions instead?



            Popular posts from this blog

            Human spaceflight

            Can not write log (Is /dev/pts mounted?) - openpty in Ubuntu-on-Windows?

            張江高科駅