Find a Cauchy sequence that doesn't $p$-converge to any rational number.












1












$begingroup$


Let $p$ be a prime number. For any ratinoal number $x$, define $$|x|_p =
begin{cases}
0 ,, & mbox{if } ,x=0 \
p^{-alpha},, & mbox{if },x=p^alphafrac{n}{m} ,,,mbox{in which }m,ninmathbb{Z},,mbox{and},,(p,mn)=1
end{cases}$$



We claim that ${a_n}_{n=1}^infty$ is a Cauchy sequence iff $,forall epsilon>0$ , $exists N>0$ s.t. $,forall m,n>N$ we have $|a_m-a_n|_p<epsilon$



We claim that ${a_n}_{n=1}^infty$ $p$-converges to $A$, in which $A$ is a rational number, iff $,forall epsilon>0$ , $exists N>0$ s.t. $,forall n>N$ we have $|a_n-A|_p<epsilon$.



OUR AIM:
Find a Cauchy sequence that doesn't $p$-converge to any rational number.



My thought



I found out one thing that might help as follows,




For rational numbers $x_1,x_2,cdots,x_n$,
$$|x_1+x_2+cdots+x_n|_ple max{|x_1|_p,|x_2|_p,cdots,|x_n|_p}$$




Proof: We only need to prove $|x+y|_ple max{|x|_p,|y|_p}$.



If one of $x$ and $y$ is $0$ , it's obvious.



If $xne 0$ and $y ne 0$ , without loss of generality we let $|x|_p ge |y|_p$ , $x=p{^{{alpha}_{1}}}frac{n_1}{m_1}$ and $y=p{^{{alpha}_{2}}}frac{n_2}{m_2}$.



So $|x+y|_p=|p^{alpha_1}frac{n_1 m_2 + p^{alpha_2-alpha_1} n_2 m_1}{m_1 m_2}|_p le p^{-alpha_1}$ , which yields the conclusion. (Considering $n_1 m_2 + p^{alpha_2-alpha_1} n_2 m_1 in mathbb{Z}$ and $(p,m_1m_2)=1$)



Through this conclusion we can easily get that ${a_n}_{n=1}^infty$ is a Cauchy sequence iff ${a_{n+1}-a_n}_{n=1}^infty$ $p$-converges to $0$.



Then I tried some sequences like $a_n=displaystylesum_{k=1}^nfrac{1}{k!}$, which is Cauchy sequence obviously, but I got stuck on how to prove it doesn't $p$-converges to a rational number $A$.



Any helps or ideas would be highly appreciated!










share|cite|improve this question











$endgroup$








  • 1




    $begingroup$
    "which is a Cauchy sequence obviously". No it isn't.
    $endgroup$
    – Lorem Ipsum
    Jan 16 at 19:22










  • $begingroup$
    How would you answer the analogous question with the usual norm, i.e. how would you write down a Cauchy sequence of rational numbers whose limit is not a rational number?
    $endgroup$
    – Lorem Ipsum
    Jan 16 at 19:24










  • $begingroup$
    Have you looked at the $p$-adic norm of $p^n$?
    $endgroup$
    – Paul Sinclair
    Jan 17 at 0:12










  • $begingroup$
    An interesting related result. A $p$-adic number is rational iff its $p$-adic expansion is eventually periodic.
    $endgroup$
    – GEdgar
    Jan 17 at 14:02
















1












$begingroup$


Let $p$ be a prime number. For any ratinoal number $x$, define $$|x|_p =
begin{cases}
0 ,, & mbox{if } ,x=0 \
p^{-alpha},, & mbox{if },x=p^alphafrac{n}{m} ,,,mbox{in which }m,ninmathbb{Z},,mbox{and},,(p,mn)=1
end{cases}$$



We claim that ${a_n}_{n=1}^infty$ is a Cauchy sequence iff $,forall epsilon>0$ , $exists N>0$ s.t. $,forall m,n>N$ we have $|a_m-a_n|_p<epsilon$



We claim that ${a_n}_{n=1}^infty$ $p$-converges to $A$, in which $A$ is a rational number, iff $,forall epsilon>0$ , $exists N>0$ s.t. $,forall n>N$ we have $|a_n-A|_p<epsilon$.



OUR AIM:
Find a Cauchy sequence that doesn't $p$-converge to any rational number.



My thought



I found out one thing that might help as follows,




For rational numbers $x_1,x_2,cdots,x_n$,
$$|x_1+x_2+cdots+x_n|_ple max{|x_1|_p,|x_2|_p,cdots,|x_n|_p}$$




Proof: We only need to prove $|x+y|_ple max{|x|_p,|y|_p}$.



If one of $x$ and $y$ is $0$ , it's obvious.



If $xne 0$ and $y ne 0$ , without loss of generality we let $|x|_p ge |y|_p$ , $x=p{^{{alpha}_{1}}}frac{n_1}{m_1}$ and $y=p{^{{alpha}_{2}}}frac{n_2}{m_2}$.



So $|x+y|_p=|p^{alpha_1}frac{n_1 m_2 + p^{alpha_2-alpha_1} n_2 m_1}{m_1 m_2}|_p le p^{-alpha_1}$ , which yields the conclusion. (Considering $n_1 m_2 + p^{alpha_2-alpha_1} n_2 m_1 in mathbb{Z}$ and $(p,m_1m_2)=1$)



Through this conclusion we can easily get that ${a_n}_{n=1}^infty$ is a Cauchy sequence iff ${a_{n+1}-a_n}_{n=1}^infty$ $p$-converges to $0$.



Then I tried some sequences like $a_n=displaystylesum_{k=1}^nfrac{1}{k!}$, which is Cauchy sequence obviously, but I got stuck on how to prove it doesn't $p$-converges to a rational number $A$.



Any helps or ideas would be highly appreciated!










share|cite|improve this question











$endgroup$








  • 1




    $begingroup$
    "which is a Cauchy sequence obviously". No it isn't.
    $endgroup$
    – Lorem Ipsum
    Jan 16 at 19:22










  • $begingroup$
    How would you answer the analogous question with the usual norm, i.e. how would you write down a Cauchy sequence of rational numbers whose limit is not a rational number?
    $endgroup$
    – Lorem Ipsum
    Jan 16 at 19:24










  • $begingroup$
    Have you looked at the $p$-adic norm of $p^n$?
    $endgroup$
    – Paul Sinclair
    Jan 17 at 0:12










  • $begingroup$
    An interesting related result. A $p$-adic number is rational iff its $p$-adic expansion is eventually periodic.
    $endgroup$
    – GEdgar
    Jan 17 at 14:02














1












1








1





$begingroup$


Let $p$ be a prime number. For any ratinoal number $x$, define $$|x|_p =
begin{cases}
0 ,, & mbox{if } ,x=0 \
p^{-alpha},, & mbox{if },x=p^alphafrac{n}{m} ,,,mbox{in which }m,ninmathbb{Z},,mbox{and},,(p,mn)=1
end{cases}$$



We claim that ${a_n}_{n=1}^infty$ is a Cauchy sequence iff $,forall epsilon>0$ , $exists N>0$ s.t. $,forall m,n>N$ we have $|a_m-a_n|_p<epsilon$



We claim that ${a_n}_{n=1}^infty$ $p$-converges to $A$, in which $A$ is a rational number, iff $,forall epsilon>0$ , $exists N>0$ s.t. $,forall n>N$ we have $|a_n-A|_p<epsilon$.



OUR AIM:
Find a Cauchy sequence that doesn't $p$-converge to any rational number.



My thought



I found out one thing that might help as follows,




For rational numbers $x_1,x_2,cdots,x_n$,
$$|x_1+x_2+cdots+x_n|_ple max{|x_1|_p,|x_2|_p,cdots,|x_n|_p}$$




Proof: We only need to prove $|x+y|_ple max{|x|_p,|y|_p}$.



If one of $x$ and $y$ is $0$ , it's obvious.



If $xne 0$ and $y ne 0$ , without loss of generality we let $|x|_p ge |y|_p$ , $x=p{^{{alpha}_{1}}}frac{n_1}{m_1}$ and $y=p{^{{alpha}_{2}}}frac{n_2}{m_2}$.



So $|x+y|_p=|p^{alpha_1}frac{n_1 m_2 + p^{alpha_2-alpha_1} n_2 m_1}{m_1 m_2}|_p le p^{-alpha_1}$ , which yields the conclusion. (Considering $n_1 m_2 + p^{alpha_2-alpha_1} n_2 m_1 in mathbb{Z}$ and $(p,m_1m_2)=1$)



Through this conclusion we can easily get that ${a_n}_{n=1}^infty$ is a Cauchy sequence iff ${a_{n+1}-a_n}_{n=1}^infty$ $p$-converges to $0$.



Then I tried some sequences like $a_n=displaystylesum_{k=1}^nfrac{1}{k!}$, which is Cauchy sequence obviously, but I got stuck on how to prove it doesn't $p$-converges to a rational number $A$.



Any helps or ideas would be highly appreciated!










share|cite|improve this question











$endgroup$




Let $p$ be a prime number. For any ratinoal number $x$, define $$|x|_p =
begin{cases}
0 ,, & mbox{if } ,x=0 \
p^{-alpha},, & mbox{if },x=p^alphafrac{n}{m} ,,,mbox{in which }m,ninmathbb{Z},,mbox{and},,(p,mn)=1
end{cases}$$



We claim that ${a_n}_{n=1}^infty$ is a Cauchy sequence iff $,forall epsilon>0$ , $exists N>0$ s.t. $,forall m,n>N$ we have $|a_m-a_n|_p<epsilon$



We claim that ${a_n}_{n=1}^infty$ $p$-converges to $A$, in which $A$ is a rational number, iff $,forall epsilon>0$ , $exists N>0$ s.t. $,forall n>N$ we have $|a_n-A|_p<epsilon$.



OUR AIM:
Find a Cauchy sequence that doesn't $p$-converge to any rational number.



My thought



I found out one thing that might help as follows,




For rational numbers $x_1,x_2,cdots,x_n$,
$$|x_1+x_2+cdots+x_n|_ple max{|x_1|_p,|x_2|_p,cdots,|x_n|_p}$$




Proof: We only need to prove $|x+y|_ple max{|x|_p,|y|_p}$.



If one of $x$ and $y$ is $0$ , it's obvious.



If $xne 0$ and $y ne 0$ , without loss of generality we let $|x|_p ge |y|_p$ , $x=p{^{{alpha}_{1}}}frac{n_1}{m_1}$ and $y=p{^{{alpha}_{2}}}frac{n_2}{m_2}$.



So $|x+y|_p=|p^{alpha_1}frac{n_1 m_2 + p^{alpha_2-alpha_1} n_2 m_1}{m_1 m_2}|_p le p^{-alpha_1}$ , which yields the conclusion. (Considering $n_1 m_2 + p^{alpha_2-alpha_1} n_2 m_1 in mathbb{Z}$ and $(p,m_1m_2)=1$)



Through this conclusion we can easily get that ${a_n}_{n=1}^infty$ is a Cauchy sequence iff ${a_{n+1}-a_n}_{n=1}^infty$ $p$-converges to $0$.



Then I tried some sequences like $a_n=displaystylesum_{k=1}^nfrac{1}{k!}$, which is Cauchy sequence obviously, but I got stuck on how to prove it doesn't $p$-converges to a rational number $A$.



Any helps or ideas would be highly appreciated!







sequences-and-series number-theory cauchy-sequences






share|cite|improve this question















share|cite|improve this question













share|cite|improve this question




share|cite|improve this question








edited Jan 16 at 17:14







Zero

















asked Jan 16 at 17:09









ZeroZero

540111




540111








  • 1




    $begingroup$
    "which is a Cauchy sequence obviously". No it isn't.
    $endgroup$
    – Lorem Ipsum
    Jan 16 at 19:22










  • $begingroup$
    How would you answer the analogous question with the usual norm, i.e. how would you write down a Cauchy sequence of rational numbers whose limit is not a rational number?
    $endgroup$
    – Lorem Ipsum
    Jan 16 at 19:24










  • $begingroup$
    Have you looked at the $p$-adic norm of $p^n$?
    $endgroup$
    – Paul Sinclair
    Jan 17 at 0:12










  • $begingroup$
    An interesting related result. A $p$-adic number is rational iff its $p$-adic expansion is eventually periodic.
    $endgroup$
    – GEdgar
    Jan 17 at 14:02














  • 1




    $begingroup$
    "which is a Cauchy sequence obviously". No it isn't.
    $endgroup$
    – Lorem Ipsum
    Jan 16 at 19:22










  • $begingroup$
    How would you answer the analogous question with the usual norm, i.e. how would you write down a Cauchy sequence of rational numbers whose limit is not a rational number?
    $endgroup$
    – Lorem Ipsum
    Jan 16 at 19:24










  • $begingroup$
    Have you looked at the $p$-adic norm of $p^n$?
    $endgroup$
    – Paul Sinclair
    Jan 17 at 0:12










  • $begingroup$
    An interesting related result. A $p$-adic number is rational iff its $p$-adic expansion is eventually periodic.
    $endgroup$
    – GEdgar
    Jan 17 at 14:02








1




1




$begingroup$
"which is a Cauchy sequence obviously". No it isn't.
$endgroup$
– Lorem Ipsum
Jan 16 at 19:22




$begingroup$
"which is a Cauchy sequence obviously". No it isn't.
$endgroup$
– Lorem Ipsum
Jan 16 at 19:22












$begingroup$
How would you answer the analogous question with the usual norm, i.e. how would you write down a Cauchy sequence of rational numbers whose limit is not a rational number?
$endgroup$
– Lorem Ipsum
Jan 16 at 19:24




$begingroup$
How would you answer the analogous question with the usual norm, i.e. how would you write down a Cauchy sequence of rational numbers whose limit is not a rational number?
$endgroup$
– Lorem Ipsum
Jan 16 at 19:24












$begingroup$
Have you looked at the $p$-adic norm of $p^n$?
$endgroup$
– Paul Sinclair
Jan 17 at 0:12




$begingroup$
Have you looked at the $p$-adic norm of $p^n$?
$endgroup$
– Paul Sinclair
Jan 17 at 0:12












$begingroup$
An interesting related result. A $p$-adic number is rational iff its $p$-adic expansion is eventually periodic.
$endgroup$
– GEdgar
Jan 17 at 14:02




$begingroup$
An interesting related result. A $p$-adic number is rational iff its $p$-adic expansion is eventually periodic.
$endgroup$
– GEdgar
Jan 17 at 14:02










2 Answers
2






active

oldest

votes


















1












$begingroup$

To answer your question you need to invoke the completion $mathbb{Q}_p$ of $(mathbb{Q},|;;|_p)$. More specifically, you need to find a Cauchy sequence of rational numbers with a limit in $mathbb{Q}_psetminusmathbb{Q}$. In order to identify the elements of $mathbb{Q}_psetminusmathbb{Q}$, we need the following theorem.




Theorem: Let
$x=sum_{i=v}^infty r_i p^iinmathbb{Q}_p$ $(vinmathbb{Z},; 0leq r_ileq
p-1)$
. Then $x$ is a rational number if and only if the sequence
$(r_i)_i$ of digits of $x$ is eventually periodic, i.e. there exists
$ninmathbb{N}$ such that the subsequence $(r_i)_{igeq n}$ is periodic.




Proof: Result 5.3 in Robert, Alain M., A course in $p$-adic analysis, Graduate Texts in Mathematics. 198. New York, NY: Springer. xv, 437 p. (2000). ZBL0947.11035.



We can use the theorem above to answer your question (and
to prove the incompleteness of $(mathbb{Q},|;;|_p)$).
Consider $x=sum_{i=0}^infty p^{i^2}inmathbb{Q}_p$.
Note that $x$ is the limit of a convergent sequence
of rational numbers, say $a_n=sum_{i=0}^n p^{i^2}$.
In fact, $|x-a_n|_p=e^{-(n+1)^2}$ for every $ninmathbb{N}$.
Thus $(a_n)_n$ is a Cauchy sequence in $(mathbb{Q},|;;|_p)$
but the theorem implies that $xnotinmathbb{Q}$,
i.e. $(a_n)_n$ is not convergent in $(mathbb{Q},|;;|_p)$.



For examples of Cauchy sequences that $p$-converge to rational numbers you can check that
$$frac{1}{1-p}=sum_{i=0}^infty p^{i}hspace{1cm}mbox{ and }hspace{1cm}-1=sum_{i=0}^infty (p-1)p^{i}$$






share|cite|improve this answer











$endgroup$





















    0












    $begingroup$

    I don't quite understand your question. You put on $mathbf Q$ the $p$-adic valuation and you show that a sequence of rationals is $p$-adically Cauchy iff the $p$-adic distance between 2 consecutive terms tends to $0$ (because of the "ultrametric inequality"). Then you ask for a Cauchy sequence that doesn't converge $p$-adically in $mathbf Q$. For this, just construct the $p$-adic completion of $mathbf Q$, which is the field $mathbf Q_p$ of $p$-adic numbers (in the same way as the archimedean completion of $mathbf Q$ is $mathbf R$)! Your question is then equivalent to the $p$-adic non completeness of $mathbf Q$. This has nothing to do with the characterization of Cauchy sequences. The usual reason invoked for the archimedean non completeness of $mathbf Q$ is that $mathbf R$ is not countable (in fact card $mathbf R=aleph_1$). The unique expansion of any non null $p$-adic number as the sum of a polynomial in $1/p$ and a power series in $p$ shows that card $mathbf Q_p$ is also $aleph_1$ .



    Addendum. If you ask for concrete examples, here are two parallel illustrations. In the archimedean case, the classical proof of the irrationality of $sqrt 2$ uses the unique factorization in $mathbf Z$: if $sqrt 2=m/n$, where $m, n$ are two coprime integers, it would follow that $2n^2=m^2$, and then unique factorization (up to a sign) would be contradicted. In the $p$-adic case, the same reasoning works at the beginning: $2n^2=m^2$ in the ring $mathbf Z_p$ of $p$-adic integers, but here unique factorization is up to units (=invertible elements) of $mathbf Z_p$ (whereas the only units of $mathbf Z$ are $pm 1$), and $2$ is a unit if $pneq 2$. A more elaborate calculation is needed. Using the binomial function $X(X-1)...(X-n+1)/n!$ , one can show that $sqrt 2in mathbf Q_p$ iff $pequiv pm 1$ mod $8$ .






    share|cite|improve this answer











    $endgroup$














      Your Answer





      StackExchange.ifUsing("editor", function () {
      return StackExchange.using("mathjaxEditing", function () {
      StackExchange.MarkdownEditor.creationCallbacks.add(function (editor, postfix) {
      StackExchange.mathjaxEditing.prepareWmdForMathJax(editor, postfix, [["$", "$"], ["\\(","\\)"]]);
      });
      });
      }, "mathjax-editing");

      StackExchange.ready(function() {
      var channelOptions = {
      tags: "".split(" "),
      id: "69"
      };
      initTagRenderer("".split(" "), "".split(" "), channelOptions);

      StackExchange.using("externalEditor", function() {
      // Have to fire editor after snippets, if snippets enabled
      if (StackExchange.settings.snippets.snippetsEnabled) {
      StackExchange.using("snippets", function() {
      createEditor();
      });
      }
      else {
      createEditor();
      }
      });

      function createEditor() {
      StackExchange.prepareEditor({
      heartbeatType: 'answer',
      autoActivateHeartbeat: false,
      convertImagesToLinks: true,
      noModals: true,
      showLowRepImageUploadWarning: true,
      reputationToPostImages: 10,
      bindNavPrevention: true,
      postfix: "",
      imageUploader: {
      brandingHtml: "Powered by u003ca class="icon-imgur-white" href="https://imgur.com/"u003eu003c/au003e",
      contentPolicyHtml: "User contributions licensed under u003ca href="https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/3.0/"u003ecc by-sa 3.0 with attribution requiredu003c/au003e u003ca href="https://stackoverflow.com/legal/content-policy"u003e(content policy)u003c/au003e",
      allowUrls: true
      },
      noCode: true, onDemand: true,
      discardSelector: ".discard-answer"
      ,immediatelyShowMarkdownHelp:true
      });


      }
      });














      draft saved

      draft discarded


















      StackExchange.ready(
      function () {
      StackExchange.openid.initPostLogin('.new-post-login', 'https%3a%2f%2fmath.stackexchange.com%2fquestions%2f3075989%2ffind-a-cauchy-sequence-that-doesnt-p-converge-to-any-rational-number%23new-answer', 'question_page');
      }
      );

      Post as a guest















      Required, but never shown

























      2 Answers
      2






      active

      oldest

      votes








      2 Answers
      2






      active

      oldest

      votes









      active

      oldest

      votes






      active

      oldest

      votes









      1












      $begingroup$

      To answer your question you need to invoke the completion $mathbb{Q}_p$ of $(mathbb{Q},|;;|_p)$. More specifically, you need to find a Cauchy sequence of rational numbers with a limit in $mathbb{Q}_psetminusmathbb{Q}$. In order to identify the elements of $mathbb{Q}_psetminusmathbb{Q}$, we need the following theorem.




      Theorem: Let
      $x=sum_{i=v}^infty r_i p^iinmathbb{Q}_p$ $(vinmathbb{Z},; 0leq r_ileq
      p-1)$
      . Then $x$ is a rational number if and only if the sequence
      $(r_i)_i$ of digits of $x$ is eventually periodic, i.e. there exists
      $ninmathbb{N}$ such that the subsequence $(r_i)_{igeq n}$ is periodic.




      Proof: Result 5.3 in Robert, Alain M., A course in $p$-adic analysis, Graduate Texts in Mathematics. 198. New York, NY: Springer. xv, 437 p. (2000). ZBL0947.11035.



      We can use the theorem above to answer your question (and
      to prove the incompleteness of $(mathbb{Q},|;;|_p)$).
      Consider $x=sum_{i=0}^infty p^{i^2}inmathbb{Q}_p$.
      Note that $x$ is the limit of a convergent sequence
      of rational numbers, say $a_n=sum_{i=0}^n p^{i^2}$.
      In fact, $|x-a_n|_p=e^{-(n+1)^2}$ for every $ninmathbb{N}$.
      Thus $(a_n)_n$ is a Cauchy sequence in $(mathbb{Q},|;;|_p)$
      but the theorem implies that $xnotinmathbb{Q}$,
      i.e. $(a_n)_n$ is not convergent in $(mathbb{Q},|;;|_p)$.



      For examples of Cauchy sequences that $p$-converge to rational numbers you can check that
      $$frac{1}{1-p}=sum_{i=0}^infty p^{i}hspace{1cm}mbox{ and }hspace{1cm}-1=sum_{i=0}^infty (p-1)p^{i}$$






      share|cite|improve this answer











      $endgroup$


















        1












        $begingroup$

        To answer your question you need to invoke the completion $mathbb{Q}_p$ of $(mathbb{Q},|;;|_p)$. More specifically, you need to find a Cauchy sequence of rational numbers with a limit in $mathbb{Q}_psetminusmathbb{Q}$. In order to identify the elements of $mathbb{Q}_psetminusmathbb{Q}$, we need the following theorem.




        Theorem: Let
        $x=sum_{i=v}^infty r_i p^iinmathbb{Q}_p$ $(vinmathbb{Z},; 0leq r_ileq
        p-1)$
        . Then $x$ is a rational number if and only if the sequence
        $(r_i)_i$ of digits of $x$ is eventually periodic, i.e. there exists
        $ninmathbb{N}$ such that the subsequence $(r_i)_{igeq n}$ is periodic.




        Proof: Result 5.3 in Robert, Alain M., A course in $p$-adic analysis, Graduate Texts in Mathematics. 198. New York, NY: Springer. xv, 437 p. (2000). ZBL0947.11035.



        We can use the theorem above to answer your question (and
        to prove the incompleteness of $(mathbb{Q},|;;|_p)$).
        Consider $x=sum_{i=0}^infty p^{i^2}inmathbb{Q}_p$.
        Note that $x$ is the limit of a convergent sequence
        of rational numbers, say $a_n=sum_{i=0}^n p^{i^2}$.
        In fact, $|x-a_n|_p=e^{-(n+1)^2}$ for every $ninmathbb{N}$.
        Thus $(a_n)_n$ is a Cauchy sequence in $(mathbb{Q},|;;|_p)$
        but the theorem implies that $xnotinmathbb{Q}$,
        i.e. $(a_n)_n$ is not convergent in $(mathbb{Q},|;;|_p)$.



        For examples of Cauchy sequences that $p$-converge to rational numbers you can check that
        $$frac{1}{1-p}=sum_{i=0}^infty p^{i}hspace{1cm}mbox{ and }hspace{1cm}-1=sum_{i=0}^infty (p-1)p^{i}$$






        share|cite|improve this answer











        $endgroup$
















          1












          1








          1





          $begingroup$

          To answer your question you need to invoke the completion $mathbb{Q}_p$ of $(mathbb{Q},|;;|_p)$. More specifically, you need to find a Cauchy sequence of rational numbers with a limit in $mathbb{Q}_psetminusmathbb{Q}$. In order to identify the elements of $mathbb{Q}_psetminusmathbb{Q}$, we need the following theorem.




          Theorem: Let
          $x=sum_{i=v}^infty r_i p^iinmathbb{Q}_p$ $(vinmathbb{Z},; 0leq r_ileq
          p-1)$
          . Then $x$ is a rational number if and only if the sequence
          $(r_i)_i$ of digits of $x$ is eventually periodic, i.e. there exists
          $ninmathbb{N}$ such that the subsequence $(r_i)_{igeq n}$ is periodic.




          Proof: Result 5.3 in Robert, Alain M., A course in $p$-adic analysis, Graduate Texts in Mathematics. 198. New York, NY: Springer. xv, 437 p. (2000). ZBL0947.11035.



          We can use the theorem above to answer your question (and
          to prove the incompleteness of $(mathbb{Q},|;;|_p)$).
          Consider $x=sum_{i=0}^infty p^{i^2}inmathbb{Q}_p$.
          Note that $x$ is the limit of a convergent sequence
          of rational numbers, say $a_n=sum_{i=0}^n p^{i^2}$.
          In fact, $|x-a_n|_p=e^{-(n+1)^2}$ for every $ninmathbb{N}$.
          Thus $(a_n)_n$ is a Cauchy sequence in $(mathbb{Q},|;;|_p)$
          but the theorem implies that $xnotinmathbb{Q}$,
          i.e. $(a_n)_n$ is not convergent in $(mathbb{Q},|;;|_p)$.



          For examples of Cauchy sequences that $p$-converge to rational numbers you can check that
          $$frac{1}{1-p}=sum_{i=0}^infty p^{i}hspace{1cm}mbox{ and }hspace{1cm}-1=sum_{i=0}^infty (p-1)p^{i}$$






          share|cite|improve this answer











          $endgroup$



          To answer your question you need to invoke the completion $mathbb{Q}_p$ of $(mathbb{Q},|;;|_p)$. More specifically, you need to find a Cauchy sequence of rational numbers with a limit in $mathbb{Q}_psetminusmathbb{Q}$. In order to identify the elements of $mathbb{Q}_psetminusmathbb{Q}$, we need the following theorem.




          Theorem: Let
          $x=sum_{i=v}^infty r_i p^iinmathbb{Q}_p$ $(vinmathbb{Z},; 0leq r_ileq
          p-1)$
          . Then $x$ is a rational number if and only if the sequence
          $(r_i)_i$ of digits of $x$ is eventually periodic, i.e. there exists
          $ninmathbb{N}$ such that the subsequence $(r_i)_{igeq n}$ is periodic.




          Proof: Result 5.3 in Robert, Alain M., A course in $p$-adic analysis, Graduate Texts in Mathematics. 198. New York, NY: Springer. xv, 437 p. (2000). ZBL0947.11035.



          We can use the theorem above to answer your question (and
          to prove the incompleteness of $(mathbb{Q},|;;|_p)$).
          Consider $x=sum_{i=0}^infty p^{i^2}inmathbb{Q}_p$.
          Note that $x$ is the limit of a convergent sequence
          of rational numbers, say $a_n=sum_{i=0}^n p^{i^2}$.
          In fact, $|x-a_n|_p=e^{-(n+1)^2}$ for every $ninmathbb{N}$.
          Thus $(a_n)_n$ is a Cauchy sequence in $(mathbb{Q},|;;|_p)$
          but the theorem implies that $xnotinmathbb{Q}$,
          i.e. $(a_n)_n$ is not convergent in $(mathbb{Q},|;;|_p)$.



          For examples of Cauchy sequences that $p$-converge to rational numbers you can check that
          $$frac{1}{1-p}=sum_{i=0}^infty p^{i}hspace{1cm}mbox{ and }hspace{1cm}-1=sum_{i=0}^infty (p-1)p^{i}$$







          share|cite|improve this answer














          share|cite|improve this answer



          share|cite|improve this answer








          edited Jan 17 at 16:03

























          answered Jan 17 at 15:33









          ChiloteChilote

          2,04211035




          2,04211035























              0












              $begingroup$

              I don't quite understand your question. You put on $mathbf Q$ the $p$-adic valuation and you show that a sequence of rationals is $p$-adically Cauchy iff the $p$-adic distance between 2 consecutive terms tends to $0$ (because of the "ultrametric inequality"). Then you ask for a Cauchy sequence that doesn't converge $p$-adically in $mathbf Q$. For this, just construct the $p$-adic completion of $mathbf Q$, which is the field $mathbf Q_p$ of $p$-adic numbers (in the same way as the archimedean completion of $mathbf Q$ is $mathbf R$)! Your question is then equivalent to the $p$-adic non completeness of $mathbf Q$. This has nothing to do with the characterization of Cauchy sequences. The usual reason invoked for the archimedean non completeness of $mathbf Q$ is that $mathbf R$ is not countable (in fact card $mathbf R=aleph_1$). The unique expansion of any non null $p$-adic number as the sum of a polynomial in $1/p$ and a power series in $p$ shows that card $mathbf Q_p$ is also $aleph_1$ .



              Addendum. If you ask for concrete examples, here are two parallel illustrations. In the archimedean case, the classical proof of the irrationality of $sqrt 2$ uses the unique factorization in $mathbf Z$: if $sqrt 2=m/n$, where $m, n$ are two coprime integers, it would follow that $2n^2=m^2$, and then unique factorization (up to a sign) would be contradicted. In the $p$-adic case, the same reasoning works at the beginning: $2n^2=m^2$ in the ring $mathbf Z_p$ of $p$-adic integers, but here unique factorization is up to units (=invertible elements) of $mathbf Z_p$ (whereas the only units of $mathbf Z$ are $pm 1$), and $2$ is a unit if $pneq 2$. A more elaborate calculation is needed. Using the binomial function $X(X-1)...(X-n+1)/n!$ , one can show that $sqrt 2in mathbf Q_p$ iff $pequiv pm 1$ mod $8$ .






              share|cite|improve this answer











              $endgroup$


















                0












                $begingroup$

                I don't quite understand your question. You put on $mathbf Q$ the $p$-adic valuation and you show that a sequence of rationals is $p$-adically Cauchy iff the $p$-adic distance between 2 consecutive terms tends to $0$ (because of the "ultrametric inequality"). Then you ask for a Cauchy sequence that doesn't converge $p$-adically in $mathbf Q$. For this, just construct the $p$-adic completion of $mathbf Q$, which is the field $mathbf Q_p$ of $p$-adic numbers (in the same way as the archimedean completion of $mathbf Q$ is $mathbf R$)! Your question is then equivalent to the $p$-adic non completeness of $mathbf Q$. This has nothing to do with the characterization of Cauchy sequences. The usual reason invoked for the archimedean non completeness of $mathbf Q$ is that $mathbf R$ is not countable (in fact card $mathbf R=aleph_1$). The unique expansion of any non null $p$-adic number as the sum of a polynomial in $1/p$ and a power series in $p$ shows that card $mathbf Q_p$ is also $aleph_1$ .



                Addendum. If you ask for concrete examples, here are two parallel illustrations. In the archimedean case, the classical proof of the irrationality of $sqrt 2$ uses the unique factorization in $mathbf Z$: if $sqrt 2=m/n$, where $m, n$ are two coprime integers, it would follow that $2n^2=m^2$, and then unique factorization (up to a sign) would be contradicted. In the $p$-adic case, the same reasoning works at the beginning: $2n^2=m^2$ in the ring $mathbf Z_p$ of $p$-adic integers, but here unique factorization is up to units (=invertible elements) of $mathbf Z_p$ (whereas the only units of $mathbf Z$ are $pm 1$), and $2$ is a unit if $pneq 2$. A more elaborate calculation is needed. Using the binomial function $X(X-1)...(X-n+1)/n!$ , one can show that $sqrt 2in mathbf Q_p$ iff $pequiv pm 1$ mod $8$ .






                share|cite|improve this answer











                $endgroup$
















                  0












                  0








                  0





                  $begingroup$

                  I don't quite understand your question. You put on $mathbf Q$ the $p$-adic valuation and you show that a sequence of rationals is $p$-adically Cauchy iff the $p$-adic distance between 2 consecutive terms tends to $0$ (because of the "ultrametric inequality"). Then you ask for a Cauchy sequence that doesn't converge $p$-adically in $mathbf Q$. For this, just construct the $p$-adic completion of $mathbf Q$, which is the field $mathbf Q_p$ of $p$-adic numbers (in the same way as the archimedean completion of $mathbf Q$ is $mathbf R$)! Your question is then equivalent to the $p$-adic non completeness of $mathbf Q$. This has nothing to do with the characterization of Cauchy sequences. The usual reason invoked for the archimedean non completeness of $mathbf Q$ is that $mathbf R$ is not countable (in fact card $mathbf R=aleph_1$). The unique expansion of any non null $p$-adic number as the sum of a polynomial in $1/p$ and a power series in $p$ shows that card $mathbf Q_p$ is also $aleph_1$ .



                  Addendum. If you ask for concrete examples, here are two parallel illustrations. In the archimedean case, the classical proof of the irrationality of $sqrt 2$ uses the unique factorization in $mathbf Z$: if $sqrt 2=m/n$, where $m, n$ are two coprime integers, it would follow that $2n^2=m^2$, and then unique factorization (up to a sign) would be contradicted. In the $p$-adic case, the same reasoning works at the beginning: $2n^2=m^2$ in the ring $mathbf Z_p$ of $p$-adic integers, but here unique factorization is up to units (=invertible elements) of $mathbf Z_p$ (whereas the only units of $mathbf Z$ are $pm 1$), and $2$ is a unit if $pneq 2$. A more elaborate calculation is needed. Using the binomial function $X(X-1)...(X-n+1)/n!$ , one can show that $sqrt 2in mathbf Q_p$ iff $pequiv pm 1$ mod $8$ .






                  share|cite|improve this answer











                  $endgroup$



                  I don't quite understand your question. You put on $mathbf Q$ the $p$-adic valuation and you show that a sequence of rationals is $p$-adically Cauchy iff the $p$-adic distance between 2 consecutive terms tends to $0$ (because of the "ultrametric inequality"). Then you ask for a Cauchy sequence that doesn't converge $p$-adically in $mathbf Q$. For this, just construct the $p$-adic completion of $mathbf Q$, which is the field $mathbf Q_p$ of $p$-adic numbers (in the same way as the archimedean completion of $mathbf Q$ is $mathbf R$)! Your question is then equivalent to the $p$-adic non completeness of $mathbf Q$. This has nothing to do with the characterization of Cauchy sequences. The usual reason invoked for the archimedean non completeness of $mathbf Q$ is that $mathbf R$ is not countable (in fact card $mathbf R=aleph_1$). The unique expansion of any non null $p$-adic number as the sum of a polynomial in $1/p$ and a power series in $p$ shows that card $mathbf Q_p$ is also $aleph_1$ .



                  Addendum. If you ask for concrete examples, here are two parallel illustrations. In the archimedean case, the classical proof of the irrationality of $sqrt 2$ uses the unique factorization in $mathbf Z$: if $sqrt 2=m/n$, where $m, n$ are two coprime integers, it would follow that $2n^2=m^2$, and then unique factorization (up to a sign) would be contradicted. In the $p$-adic case, the same reasoning works at the beginning: $2n^2=m^2$ in the ring $mathbf Z_p$ of $p$-adic integers, but here unique factorization is up to units (=invertible elements) of $mathbf Z_p$ (whereas the only units of $mathbf Z$ are $pm 1$), and $2$ is a unit if $pneq 2$. A more elaborate calculation is needed. Using the binomial function $X(X-1)...(X-n+1)/n!$ , one can show that $sqrt 2in mathbf Q_p$ iff $pequiv pm 1$ mod $8$ .







                  share|cite|improve this answer














                  share|cite|improve this answer



                  share|cite|improve this answer








                  edited Jan 23 at 16:16

























                  answered Jan 17 at 13:53









                  nguyen quang donguyen quang do

                  9,0491724




                  9,0491724






























                      draft saved

                      draft discarded




















































                      Thanks for contributing an answer to Mathematics Stack Exchange!


                      • Please be sure to answer the question. Provide details and share your research!

                      But avoid



                      • Asking for help, clarification, or responding to other answers.

                      • Making statements based on opinion; back them up with references or personal experience.


                      Use MathJax to format equations. MathJax reference.


                      To learn more, see our tips on writing great answers.




                      draft saved


                      draft discarded














                      StackExchange.ready(
                      function () {
                      StackExchange.openid.initPostLogin('.new-post-login', 'https%3a%2f%2fmath.stackexchange.com%2fquestions%2f3075989%2ffind-a-cauchy-sequence-that-doesnt-p-converge-to-any-rational-number%23new-answer', 'question_page');
                      }
                      );

                      Post as a guest















                      Required, but never shown





















































                      Required, but never shown














                      Required, but never shown












                      Required, but never shown







                      Required, but never shown

































                      Required, but never shown














                      Required, but never shown












                      Required, but never shown







                      Required, but never shown







                      Popular posts from this blog

                      Human spaceflight

                      Can not write log (Is /dev/pts mounted?) - openpty in Ubuntu-on-Windows?

                      File:DeusFollowingSea.jpg