A nonsplit short exact sequence of abelian groups with $B cong A oplus C$












24















A homework problem asked to find a short exact sequence of abelian groups
$$0 rightarrow A rightarrow B rightarrow C rightarrow 0$$ such that $$B cong A oplus C$$ although the sequence does not split.




My solution:
$$0 rightarrow mathbb{Z} overset{i}{rightarrow}
mathbb{Z} oplus (mathbb{Z}/2mathbb{Z})^{mathbb{N}} overset{p}{rightarrow}
(mathbb{Z}/2mathbb{Z})^{mathbb{N}} rightarrow 0$$
with $i(x)=(2x,0,0,dotsc)$ and $p(x,y_1,y_2,dotsc)=(x+2mathbb{Z},y_1,y_2,dotsc)$.



My new questions:





  1. Is there an example with finite/finitely generated abelian groups?

  2. If the answer to $(1)$ is negative, will it help to pass to general $R$-modules for some ring $R$?











share|cite|improve this question




















  • 4




    FYI: A different example, still with infinite groups, is Example 6.35 of Rotman's Advanced Modern Algebra (2nd ed., AMS).
    – KCd
    Apr 22 '12 at 21:55
















24















A homework problem asked to find a short exact sequence of abelian groups
$$0 rightarrow A rightarrow B rightarrow C rightarrow 0$$ such that $$B cong A oplus C$$ although the sequence does not split.




My solution:
$$0 rightarrow mathbb{Z} overset{i}{rightarrow}
mathbb{Z} oplus (mathbb{Z}/2mathbb{Z})^{mathbb{N}} overset{p}{rightarrow}
(mathbb{Z}/2mathbb{Z})^{mathbb{N}} rightarrow 0$$
with $i(x)=(2x,0,0,dotsc)$ and $p(x,y_1,y_2,dotsc)=(x+2mathbb{Z},y_1,y_2,dotsc)$.



My new questions:





  1. Is there an example with finite/finitely generated abelian groups?

  2. If the answer to $(1)$ is negative, will it help to pass to general $R$-modules for some ring $R$?











share|cite|improve this question




















  • 4




    FYI: A different example, still with infinite groups, is Example 6.35 of Rotman's Advanced Modern Algebra (2nd ed., AMS).
    – KCd
    Apr 22 '12 at 21:55














24












24








24


21






A homework problem asked to find a short exact sequence of abelian groups
$$0 rightarrow A rightarrow B rightarrow C rightarrow 0$$ such that $$B cong A oplus C$$ although the sequence does not split.




My solution:
$$0 rightarrow mathbb{Z} overset{i}{rightarrow}
mathbb{Z} oplus (mathbb{Z}/2mathbb{Z})^{mathbb{N}} overset{p}{rightarrow}
(mathbb{Z}/2mathbb{Z})^{mathbb{N}} rightarrow 0$$
with $i(x)=(2x,0,0,dotsc)$ and $p(x,y_1,y_2,dotsc)=(x+2mathbb{Z},y_1,y_2,dotsc)$.



My new questions:





  1. Is there an example with finite/finitely generated abelian groups?

  2. If the answer to $(1)$ is negative, will it help to pass to general $R$-modules for some ring $R$?











share|cite|improve this question
















A homework problem asked to find a short exact sequence of abelian groups
$$0 rightarrow A rightarrow B rightarrow C rightarrow 0$$ such that $$B cong A oplus C$$ although the sequence does not split.




My solution:
$$0 rightarrow mathbb{Z} overset{i}{rightarrow}
mathbb{Z} oplus (mathbb{Z}/2mathbb{Z})^{mathbb{N}} overset{p}{rightarrow}
(mathbb{Z}/2mathbb{Z})^{mathbb{N}} rightarrow 0$$
with $i(x)=(2x,0,0,dotsc)$ and $p(x,y_1,y_2,dotsc)=(x+2mathbb{Z},y_1,y_2,dotsc)$.



My new questions:





  1. Is there an example with finite/finitely generated abelian groups?

  2. If the answer to $(1)$ is negative, will it help to pass to general $R$-modules for some ring $R$?








abstract-algebra abelian-groups exact-sequence






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edited Jun 25 '16 at 13:30









Watson

15.8k92970




15.8k92970










asked Apr 22 '12 at 19:07









user3533

2,0051726




2,0051726








  • 4




    FYI: A different example, still with infinite groups, is Example 6.35 of Rotman's Advanced Modern Algebra (2nd ed., AMS).
    – KCd
    Apr 22 '12 at 21:55














  • 4




    FYI: A different example, still with infinite groups, is Example 6.35 of Rotman's Advanced Modern Algebra (2nd ed., AMS).
    – KCd
    Apr 22 '12 at 21:55








4




4




FYI: A different example, still with infinite groups, is Example 6.35 of Rotman's Advanced Modern Algebra (2nd ed., AMS).
– KCd
Apr 22 '12 at 21:55




FYI: A different example, still with infinite groups, is Example 6.35 of Rotman's Advanced Modern Algebra (2nd ed., AMS).
– KCd
Apr 22 '12 at 21:55










3 Answers
3






active

oldest

votes


















13














There is no counterexample with $A,B,C$ finitely generated abelian groups. There is, more generally, no counterexample with $A,B,C$ finitely generated modules over any noetherian ring $R$.



To see this, consider the exact sequence



$$0rightarrowmathrm{Hom}(C,A)rightarrowmathrm{Hom}(B,A)rightarrow mathrm{Hom}(A,A).$$



The original sequence splits if and only if this sequence is exact on the right. If $A$, $B$ and $C$ are of finite length as modules, this follows immediately just by counting lengths. Otherwise, it's enough to show exactness after localizing and completing at an arbitrary prime $P$, and for this it's enough to show exactness after tensoring with $R/P^n$, and for this you can assume the lengths are finite, which is the case we've already dealt with.






share|cite|improve this answer























  • Sorry, I'm quite unfamiliar with techniques on localization and completion you're referring to. Do you have any reference?
    – Frank Science
    Jul 1 '16 at 13:48










  • @FrankScience: Any standard textbook on commutative algebra will do. My favorite is Atiyah-MacDonald.
    – WillO
    Jul 1 '16 at 21:45










  • I didn't read last chapters of Atiyah-Macdonald (that involves things like Artin-Rees). By localization and completion, I mean using this technique to reduce general cases to Artinian cases, which I cannot remember that appears in Atiyah-Macdonald.
    – Frank Science
    Jul 2 '16 at 3:49










  • And on this specific problem, we know that exactness is stalk-local, and I believe that under some finiteness condition (like Noetherian, finitely presented, etc), split-ness is also stalk-local (since we have some base-change property of $operatorname{Ext}$, maybe one can find some elementary proof, say passage from stalks to a fundamental open set). But for completion, I know nothing, except that it's an exact functor (under some finiteness condition).
    – Frank Science
    Jul 2 '16 at 3:52












  • @FrankScience : Once you've reduced to $R$ local, with maximal ideal $P$, the completion $hat{R}$ is faithfully flat over $R$, which means that a sequence of $R$-modules is exact if and only if it becomes exact after tensoring with $hat{R}$.. But $hat{R}$ is an inverse limit of the $R/P^k$, and exactness behaves well with respect to inverse limits, so that exactness mod $P^k$ for each $k$ (which follows from counting lengths) implies exactness over the completion, as needed.
    – WillO
    Jul 2 '16 at 16:41





















10














I'm sorry, but my answer uses Ext groups, which may not be in the scope of your course.



I don't know of a simple example with finitely generated abelian groups for the following reason: if $0 rightarrow mathbb Z rightarrow E rightarrow mathbb Z / n mathbb Z rightarrow 0$ is an extension represented by $r+n mathbb Z in operatorname{Ext}^1(mathbb Z,mathbb Z/nmathbb Z)cong mathbb Z/nmathbb Z$, then one can show that $E cong mathbb Z oplus mathbb Z/dmathbb Z$ where $d$ is the highest common factor of $r$ and $n$. If you assume this sequence doesn't split, then $r$ is not a multiple of $n$ and $d<n$, so the middle term will never be isomorphic to the direct sum of the of the first and third.



However, you can get a simple example using modules in the following way. Let $G=langle grangle$ be an infinite cyclic group and let $mathbb Z G$ be the associated commutative group ring. Consider $0 rightarrow mathbb Z rightarrow mathbb Z oplus mathbb Z rightarrow mathbb Z rightarrow 0$ a short exact sequence of $mathbb Z G$-modules where the first map is inclusion into the first component and the second map is projection onto the second. Let $g$ act on $mathbb Z oplus mathbb Z$ by
$bigl(begin{smallmatrix}
1&1\ 0&1
end{smallmatrix} bigr)$. Then $operatorname{Ext}^1_{mathbb Z G}(mathbb Z, mathbb Z) cong mathbb Z$ and this extension corresponds to $1$. If you let $g$ act by $bigl(begin{smallmatrix}
1&n\ 0&1 end{smallmatrix} bigr)$ it corresponds to $n$. As long as $n>0$ this is a non-split short exact sequence where the direct sum of the outside terms are isomorphic to the middle one. However, this example is far from elementary, and I apologize for that.






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  • I should add that there is a 1-1 correspondence between elements of $Ext^1(C,A)$ and short exact sequences $0 rightarrow A rightarrow B rightarrow C rightarrow 0$ and this sequence splits iff it corresponds to the $0$ element of the Ext group.
    – Parsa
    Apr 22 '12 at 22:50






  • 1




    This looks great, but I don't yet have the tools to understand it. When I do, I will verify it's correct and (probably) accept it. Thank you very much!
    – user3533
    Apr 30 '12 at 20:34






  • 3




    In your SES of $mathbb{Z}G$-modules, the middle term is isomorphic to the direct sum of the other two as groups, but not as $mathbb{Z}G$-modules: $g$ acts trivially on the left and right copies of $mathbb{Z}$, but not on the middle $mathbb{Z}oplusmathbb{Z}$.
    – Julian Rosen
    Dec 8 '15 at 5:02








  • 4




    I don't think the last example is valid. You should study the split-ness of $0tomathbb Ztomathbb Zoplusmathbb Ztomathbb Zto0$ in the Abelian category of Abelian groups, not in the category of $mathbb ZG$-modules.
    – Frank Science
    Jul 2 '16 at 3:58










  • JulianRosen and FrankScience have explained why this example is wrong. My answer explains why it never had a chance to be right.
    – WillO
    Aug 9 '17 at 3:48



















0














See the answer in this question:



In R-Mod Category, example for $Bcong A oplus C nRightarrow 0 to A to B to C to0$ splits.



It's similar to WillO's.






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    3 Answers
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    oldest

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    3 Answers
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    13














    There is no counterexample with $A,B,C$ finitely generated abelian groups. There is, more generally, no counterexample with $A,B,C$ finitely generated modules over any noetherian ring $R$.



    To see this, consider the exact sequence



    $$0rightarrowmathrm{Hom}(C,A)rightarrowmathrm{Hom}(B,A)rightarrow mathrm{Hom}(A,A).$$



    The original sequence splits if and only if this sequence is exact on the right. If $A$, $B$ and $C$ are of finite length as modules, this follows immediately just by counting lengths. Otherwise, it's enough to show exactness after localizing and completing at an arbitrary prime $P$, and for this it's enough to show exactness after tensoring with $R/P^n$, and for this you can assume the lengths are finite, which is the case we've already dealt with.






    share|cite|improve this answer























    • Sorry, I'm quite unfamiliar with techniques on localization and completion you're referring to. Do you have any reference?
      – Frank Science
      Jul 1 '16 at 13:48










    • @FrankScience: Any standard textbook on commutative algebra will do. My favorite is Atiyah-MacDonald.
      – WillO
      Jul 1 '16 at 21:45










    • I didn't read last chapters of Atiyah-Macdonald (that involves things like Artin-Rees). By localization and completion, I mean using this technique to reduce general cases to Artinian cases, which I cannot remember that appears in Atiyah-Macdonald.
      – Frank Science
      Jul 2 '16 at 3:49










    • And on this specific problem, we know that exactness is stalk-local, and I believe that under some finiteness condition (like Noetherian, finitely presented, etc), split-ness is also stalk-local (since we have some base-change property of $operatorname{Ext}$, maybe one can find some elementary proof, say passage from stalks to a fundamental open set). But for completion, I know nothing, except that it's an exact functor (under some finiteness condition).
      – Frank Science
      Jul 2 '16 at 3:52












    • @FrankScience : Once you've reduced to $R$ local, with maximal ideal $P$, the completion $hat{R}$ is faithfully flat over $R$, which means that a sequence of $R$-modules is exact if and only if it becomes exact after tensoring with $hat{R}$.. But $hat{R}$ is an inverse limit of the $R/P^k$, and exactness behaves well with respect to inverse limits, so that exactness mod $P^k$ for each $k$ (which follows from counting lengths) implies exactness over the completion, as needed.
      – WillO
      Jul 2 '16 at 16:41


















    13














    There is no counterexample with $A,B,C$ finitely generated abelian groups. There is, more generally, no counterexample with $A,B,C$ finitely generated modules over any noetherian ring $R$.



    To see this, consider the exact sequence



    $$0rightarrowmathrm{Hom}(C,A)rightarrowmathrm{Hom}(B,A)rightarrow mathrm{Hom}(A,A).$$



    The original sequence splits if and only if this sequence is exact on the right. If $A$, $B$ and $C$ are of finite length as modules, this follows immediately just by counting lengths. Otherwise, it's enough to show exactness after localizing and completing at an arbitrary prime $P$, and for this it's enough to show exactness after tensoring with $R/P^n$, and for this you can assume the lengths are finite, which is the case we've already dealt with.






    share|cite|improve this answer























    • Sorry, I'm quite unfamiliar with techniques on localization and completion you're referring to. Do you have any reference?
      – Frank Science
      Jul 1 '16 at 13:48










    • @FrankScience: Any standard textbook on commutative algebra will do. My favorite is Atiyah-MacDonald.
      – WillO
      Jul 1 '16 at 21:45










    • I didn't read last chapters of Atiyah-Macdonald (that involves things like Artin-Rees). By localization and completion, I mean using this technique to reduce general cases to Artinian cases, which I cannot remember that appears in Atiyah-Macdonald.
      – Frank Science
      Jul 2 '16 at 3:49










    • And on this specific problem, we know that exactness is stalk-local, and I believe that under some finiteness condition (like Noetherian, finitely presented, etc), split-ness is also stalk-local (since we have some base-change property of $operatorname{Ext}$, maybe one can find some elementary proof, say passage from stalks to a fundamental open set). But for completion, I know nothing, except that it's an exact functor (under some finiteness condition).
      – Frank Science
      Jul 2 '16 at 3:52












    • @FrankScience : Once you've reduced to $R$ local, with maximal ideal $P$, the completion $hat{R}$ is faithfully flat over $R$, which means that a sequence of $R$-modules is exact if and only if it becomes exact after tensoring with $hat{R}$.. But $hat{R}$ is an inverse limit of the $R/P^k$, and exactness behaves well with respect to inverse limits, so that exactness mod $P^k$ for each $k$ (which follows from counting lengths) implies exactness over the completion, as needed.
      – WillO
      Jul 2 '16 at 16:41
















    13












    13








    13






    There is no counterexample with $A,B,C$ finitely generated abelian groups. There is, more generally, no counterexample with $A,B,C$ finitely generated modules over any noetherian ring $R$.



    To see this, consider the exact sequence



    $$0rightarrowmathrm{Hom}(C,A)rightarrowmathrm{Hom}(B,A)rightarrow mathrm{Hom}(A,A).$$



    The original sequence splits if and only if this sequence is exact on the right. If $A$, $B$ and $C$ are of finite length as modules, this follows immediately just by counting lengths. Otherwise, it's enough to show exactness after localizing and completing at an arbitrary prime $P$, and for this it's enough to show exactness after tensoring with $R/P^n$, and for this you can assume the lengths are finite, which is the case we've already dealt with.






    share|cite|improve this answer














    There is no counterexample with $A,B,C$ finitely generated abelian groups. There is, more generally, no counterexample with $A,B,C$ finitely generated modules over any noetherian ring $R$.



    To see this, consider the exact sequence



    $$0rightarrowmathrm{Hom}(C,A)rightarrowmathrm{Hom}(B,A)rightarrow mathrm{Hom}(A,A).$$



    The original sequence splits if and only if this sequence is exact on the right. If $A$, $B$ and $C$ are of finite length as modules, this follows immediately just by counting lengths. Otherwise, it's enough to show exactness after localizing and completing at an arbitrary prime $P$, and for this it's enough to show exactness after tensoring with $R/P^n$, and for this you can assume the lengths are finite, which is the case we've already dealt with.







    share|cite|improve this answer














    share|cite|improve this answer



    share|cite|improve this answer








    edited Apr 8 '17 at 16:21









    user26857

    39.2k123983




    39.2k123983










    answered Aug 8 '14 at 21:23









    WillO

    2,3281321




    2,3281321












    • Sorry, I'm quite unfamiliar with techniques on localization and completion you're referring to. Do you have any reference?
      – Frank Science
      Jul 1 '16 at 13:48










    • @FrankScience: Any standard textbook on commutative algebra will do. My favorite is Atiyah-MacDonald.
      – WillO
      Jul 1 '16 at 21:45










    • I didn't read last chapters of Atiyah-Macdonald (that involves things like Artin-Rees). By localization and completion, I mean using this technique to reduce general cases to Artinian cases, which I cannot remember that appears in Atiyah-Macdonald.
      – Frank Science
      Jul 2 '16 at 3:49










    • And on this specific problem, we know that exactness is stalk-local, and I believe that under some finiteness condition (like Noetherian, finitely presented, etc), split-ness is also stalk-local (since we have some base-change property of $operatorname{Ext}$, maybe one can find some elementary proof, say passage from stalks to a fundamental open set). But for completion, I know nothing, except that it's an exact functor (under some finiteness condition).
      – Frank Science
      Jul 2 '16 at 3:52












    • @FrankScience : Once you've reduced to $R$ local, with maximal ideal $P$, the completion $hat{R}$ is faithfully flat over $R$, which means that a sequence of $R$-modules is exact if and only if it becomes exact after tensoring with $hat{R}$.. But $hat{R}$ is an inverse limit of the $R/P^k$, and exactness behaves well with respect to inverse limits, so that exactness mod $P^k$ for each $k$ (which follows from counting lengths) implies exactness over the completion, as needed.
      – WillO
      Jul 2 '16 at 16:41




















    • Sorry, I'm quite unfamiliar with techniques on localization and completion you're referring to. Do you have any reference?
      – Frank Science
      Jul 1 '16 at 13:48










    • @FrankScience: Any standard textbook on commutative algebra will do. My favorite is Atiyah-MacDonald.
      – WillO
      Jul 1 '16 at 21:45










    • I didn't read last chapters of Atiyah-Macdonald (that involves things like Artin-Rees). By localization and completion, I mean using this technique to reduce general cases to Artinian cases, which I cannot remember that appears in Atiyah-Macdonald.
      – Frank Science
      Jul 2 '16 at 3:49










    • And on this specific problem, we know that exactness is stalk-local, and I believe that under some finiteness condition (like Noetherian, finitely presented, etc), split-ness is also stalk-local (since we have some base-change property of $operatorname{Ext}$, maybe one can find some elementary proof, say passage from stalks to a fundamental open set). But for completion, I know nothing, except that it's an exact functor (under some finiteness condition).
      – Frank Science
      Jul 2 '16 at 3:52












    • @FrankScience : Once you've reduced to $R$ local, with maximal ideal $P$, the completion $hat{R}$ is faithfully flat over $R$, which means that a sequence of $R$-modules is exact if and only if it becomes exact after tensoring with $hat{R}$.. But $hat{R}$ is an inverse limit of the $R/P^k$, and exactness behaves well with respect to inverse limits, so that exactness mod $P^k$ for each $k$ (which follows from counting lengths) implies exactness over the completion, as needed.
      – WillO
      Jul 2 '16 at 16:41


















    Sorry, I'm quite unfamiliar with techniques on localization and completion you're referring to. Do you have any reference?
    – Frank Science
    Jul 1 '16 at 13:48




    Sorry, I'm quite unfamiliar with techniques on localization and completion you're referring to. Do you have any reference?
    – Frank Science
    Jul 1 '16 at 13:48












    @FrankScience: Any standard textbook on commutative algebra will do. My favorite is Atiyah-MacDonald.
    – WillO
    Jul 1 '16 at 21:45




    @FrankScience: Any standard textbook on commutative algebra will do. My favorite is Atiyah-MacDonald.
    – WillO
    Jul 1 '16 at 21:45












    I didn't read last chapters of Atiyah-Macdonald (that involves things like Artin-Rees). By localization and completion, I mean using this technique to reduce general cases to Artinian cases, which I cannot remember that appears in Atiyah-Macdonald.
    – Frank Science
    Jul 2 '16 at 3:49




    I didn't read last chapters of Atiyah-Macdonald (that involves things like Artin-Rees). By localization and completion, I mean using this technique to reduce general cases to Artinian cases, which I cannot remember that appears in Atiyah-Macdonald.
    – Frank Science
    Jul 2 '16 at 3:49












    And on this specific problem, we know that exactness is stalk-local, and I believe that under some finiteness condition (like Noetherian, finitely presented, etc), split-ness is also stalk-local (since we have some base-change property of $operatorname{Ext}$, maybe one can find some elementary proof, say passage from stalks to a fundamental open set). But for completion, I know nothing, except that it's an exact functor (under some finiteness condition).
    – Frank Science
    Jul 2 '16 at 3:52






    And on this specific problem, we know that exactness is stalk-local, and I believe that under some finiteness condition (like Noetherian, finitely presented, etc), split-ness is also stalk-local (since we have some base-change property of $operatorname{Ext}$, maybe one can find some elementary proof, say passage from stalks to a fundamental open set). But for completion, I know nothing, except that it's an exact functor (under some finiteness condition).
    – Frank Science
    Jul 2 '16 at 3:52














    @FrankScience : Once you've reduced to $R$ local, with maximal ideal $P$, the completion $hat{R}$ is faithfully flat over $R$, which means that a sequence of $R$-modules is exact if and only if it becomes exact after tensoring with $hat{R}$.. But $hat{R}$ is an inverse limit of the $R/P^k$, and exactness behaves well with respect to inverse limits, so that exactness mod $P^k$ for each $k$ (which follows from counting lengths) implies exactness over the completion, as needed.
    – WillO
    Jul 2 '16 at 16:41






    @FrankScience : Once you've reduced to $R$ local, with maximal ideal $P$, the completion $hat{R}$ is faithfully flat over $R$, which means that a sequence of $R$-modules is exact if and only if it becomes exact after tensoring with $hat{R}$.. But $hat{R}$ is an inverse limit of the $R/P^k$, and exactness behaves well with respect to inverse limits, so that exactness mod $P^k$ for each $k$ (which follows from counting lengths) implies exactness over the completion, as needed.
    – WillO
    Jul 2 '16 at 16:41













    10














    I'm sorry, but my answer uses Ext groups, which may not be in the scope of your course.



    I don't know of a simple example with finitely generated abelian groups for the following reason: if $0 rightarrow mathbb Z rightarrow E rightarrow mathbb Z / n mathbb Z rightarrow 0$ is an extension represented by $r+n mathbb Z in operatorname{Ext}^1(mathbb Z,mathbb Z/nmathbb Z)cong mathbb Z/nmathbb Z$, then one can show that $E cong mathbb Z oplus mathbb Z/dmathbb Z$ where $d$ is the highest common factor of $r$ and $n$. If you assume this sequence doesn't split, then $r$ is not a multiple of $n$ and $d<n$, so the middle term will never be isomorphic to the direct sum of the of the first and third.



    However, you can get a simple example using modules in the following way. Let $G=langle grangle$ be an infinite cyclic group and let $mathbb Z G$ be the associated commutative group ring. Consider $0 rightarrow mathbb Z rightarrow mathbb Z oplus mathbb Z rightarrow mathbb Z rightarrow 0$ a short exact sequence of $mathbb Z G$-modules where the first map is inclusion into the first component and the second map is projection onto the second. Let $g$ act on $mathbb Z oplus mathbb Z$ by
    $bigl(begin{smallmatrix}
    1&1\ 0&1
    end{smallmatrix} bigr)$. Then $operatorname{Ext}^1_{mathbb Z G}(mathbb Z, mathbb Z) cong mathbb Z$ and this extension corresponds to $1$. If you let $g$ act by $bigl(begin{smallmatrix}
    1&n\ 0&1 end{smallmatrix} bigr)$ it corresponds to $n$. As long as $n>0$ this is a non-split short exact sequence where the direct sum of the outside terms are isomorphic to the middle one. However, this example is far from elementary, and I apologize for that.






    share|cite|improve this answer























    • I should add that there is a 1-1 correspondence between elements of $Ext^1(C,A)$ and short exact sequences $0 rightarrow A rightarrow B rightarrow C rightarrow 0$ and this sequence splits iff it corresponds to the $0$ element of the Ext group.
      – Parsa
      Apr 22 '12 at 22:50






    • 1




      This looks great, but I don't yet have the tools to understand it. When I do, I will verify it's correct and (probably) accept it. Thank you very much!
      – user3533
      Apr 30 '12 at 20:34






    • 3




      In your SES of $mathbb{Z}G$-modules, the middle term is isomorphic to the direct sum of the other two as groups, but not as $mathbb{Z}G$-modules: $g$ acts trivially on the left and right copies of $mathbb{Z}$, but not on the middle $mathbb{Z}oplusmathbb{Z}$.
      – Julian Rosen
      Dec 8 '15 at 5:02








    • 4




      I don't think the last example is valid. You should study the split-ness of $0tomathbb Ztomathbb Zoplusmathbb Ztomathbb Zto0$ in the Abelian category of Abelian groups, not in the category of $mathbb ZG$-modules.
      – Frank Science
      Jul 2 '16 at 3:58










    • JulianRosen and FrankScience have explained why this example is wrong. My answer explains why it never had a chance to be right.
      – WillO
      Aug 9 '17 at 3:48
















    10














    I'm sorry, but my answer uses Ext groups, which may not be in the scope of your course.



    I don't know of a simple example with finitely generated abelian groups for the following reason: if $0 rightarrow mathbb Z rightarrow E rightarrow mathbb Z / n mathbb Z rightarrow 0$ is an extension represented by $r+n mathbb Z in operatorname{Ext}^1(mathbb Z,mathbb Z/nmathbb Z)cong mathbb Z/nmathbb Z$, then one can show that $E cong mathbb Z oplus mathbb Z/dmathbb Z$ where $d$ is the highest common factor of $r$ and $n$. If you assume this sequence doesn't split, then $r$ is not a multiple of $n$ and $d<n$, so the middle term will never be isomorphic to the direct sum of the of the first and third.



    However, you can get a simple example using modules in the following way. Let $G=langle grangle$ be an infinite cyclic group and let $mathbb Z G$ be the associated commutative group ring. Consider $0 rightarrow mathbb Z rightarrow mathbb Z oplus mathbb Z rightarrow mathbb Z rightarrow 0$ a short exact sequence of $mathbb Z G$-modules where the first map is inclusion into the first component and the second map is projection onto the second. Let $g$ act on $mathbb Z oplus mathbb Z$ by
    $bigl(begin{smallmatrix}
    1&1\ 0&1
    end{smallmatrix} bigr)$. Then $operatorname{Ext}^1_{mathbb Z G}(mathbb Z, mathbb Z) cong mathbb Z$ and this extension corresponds to $1$. If you let $g$ act by $bigl(begin{smallmatrix}
    1&n\ 0&1 end{smallmatrix} bigr)$ it corresponds to $n$. As long as $n>0$ this is a non-split short exact sequence where the direct sum of the outside terms are isomorphic to the middle one. However, this example is far from elementary, and I apologize for that.






    share|cite|improve this answer























    • I should add that there is a 1-1 correspondence between elements of $Ext^1(C,A)$ and short exact sequences $0 rightarrow A rightarrow B rightarrow C rightarrow 0$ and this sequence splits iff it corresponds to the $0$ element of the Ext group.
      – Parsa
      Apr 22 '12 at 22:50






    • 1




      This looks great, but I don't yet have the tools to understand it. When I do, I will verify it's correct and (probably) accept it. Thank you very much!
      – user3533
      Apr 30 '12 at 20:34






    • 3




      In your SES of $mathbb{Z}G$-modules, the middle term is isomorphic to the direct sum of the other two as groups, but not as $mathbb{Z}G$-modules: $g$ acts trivially on the left and right copies of $mathbb{Z}$, but not on the middle $mathbb{Z}oplusmathbb{Z}$.
      – Julian Rosen
      Dec 8 '15 at 5:02








    • 4




      I don't think the last example is valid. You should study the split-ness of $0tomathbb Ztomathbb Zoplusmathbb Ztomathbb Zto0$ in the Abelian category of Abelian groups, not in the category of $mathbb ZG$-modules.
      – Frank Science
      Jul 2 '16 at 3:58










    • JulianRosen and FrankScience have explained why this example is wrong. My answer explains why it never had a chance to be right.
      – WillO
      Aug 9 '17 at 3:48














    10












    10








    10






    I'm sorry, but my answer uses Ext groups, which may not be in the scope of your course.



    I don't know of a simple example with finitely generated abelian groups for the following reason: if $0 rightarrow mathbb Z rightarrow E rightarrow mathbb Z / n mathbb Z rightarrow 0$ is an extension represented by $r+n mathbb Z in operatorname{Ext}^1(mathbb Z,mathbb Z/nmathbb Z)cong mathbb Z/nmathbb Z$, then one can show that $E cong mathbb Z oplus mathbb Z/dmathbb Z$ where $d$ is the highest common factor of $r$ and $n$. If you assume this sequence doesn't split, then $r$ is not a multiple of $n$ and $d<n$, so the middle term will never be isomorphic to the direct sum of the of the first and third.



    However, you can get a simple example using modules in the following way. Let $G=langle grangle$ be an infinite cyclic group and let $mathbb Z G$ be the associated commutative group ring. Consider $0 rightarrow mathbb Z rightarrow mathbb Z oplus mathbb Z rightarrow mathbb Z rightarrow 0$ a short exact sequence of $mathbb Z G$-modules where the first map is inclusion into the first component and the second map is projection onto the second. Let $g$ act on $mathbb Z oplus mathbb Z$ by
    $bigl(begin{smallmatrix}
    1&1\ 0&1
    end{smallmatrix} bigr)$. Then $operatorname{Ext}^1_{mathbb Z G}(mathbb Z, mathbb Z) cong mathbb Z$ and this extension corresponds to $1$. If you let $g$ act by $bigl(begin{smallmatrix}
    1&n\ 0&1 end{smallmatrix} bigr)$ it corresponds to $n$. As long as $n>0$ this is a non-split short exact sequence where the direct sum of the outside terms are isomorphic to the middle one. However, this example is far from elementary, and I apologize for that.






    share|cite|improve this answer














    I'm sorry, but my answer uses Ext groups, which may not be in the scope of your course.



    I don't know of a simple example with finitely generated abelian groups for the following reason: if $0 rightarrow mathbb Z rightarrow E rightarrow mathbb Z / n mathbb Z rightarrow 0$ is an extension represented by $r+n mathbb Z in operatorname{Ext}^1(mathbb Z,mathbb Z/nmathbb Z)cong mathbb Z/nmathbb Z$, then one can show that $E cong mathbb Z oplus mathbb Z/dmathbb Z$ where $d$ is the highest common factor of $r$ and $n$. If you assume this sequence doesn't split, then $r$ is not a multiple of $n$ and $d<n$, so the middle term will never be isomorphic to the direct sum of the of the first and third.



    However, you can get a simple example using modules in the following way. Let $G=langle grangle$ be an infinite cyclic group and let $mathbb Z G$ be the associated commutative group ring. Consider $0 rightarrow mathbb Z rightarrow mathbb Z oplus mathbb Z rightarrow mathbb Z rightarrow 0$ a short exact sequence of $mathbb Z G$-modules where the first map is inclusion into the first component and the second map is projection onto the second. Let $g$ act on $mathbb Z oplus mathbb Z$ by
    $bigl(begin{smallmatrix}
    1&1\ 0&1
    end{smallmatrix} bigr)$. Then $operatorname{Ext}^1_{mathbb Z G}(mathbb Z, mathbb Z) cong mathbb Z$ and this extension corresponds to $1$. If you let $g$ act by $bigl(begin{smallmatrix}
    1&n\ 0&1 end{smallmatrix} bigr)$ it corresponds to $n$. As long as $n>0$ this is a non-split short exact sequence where the direct sum of the outside terms are isomorphic to the middle one. However, this example is far from elementary, and I apologize for that.







    share|cite|improve this answer














    share|cite|improve this answer



    share|cite|improve this answer








    edited Sep 1 '13 at 21:58







    user26857

















    answered Apr 22 '12 at 22:47









    Parsa

    1,689915




    1,689915












    • I should add that there is a 1-1 correspondence between elements of $Ext^1(C,A)$ and short exact sequences $0 rightarrow A rightarrow B rightarrow C rightarrow 0$ and this sequence splits iff it corresponds to the $0$ element of the Ext group.
      – Parsa
      Apr 22 '12 at 22:50






    • 1




      This looks great, but I don't yet have the tools to understand it. When I do, I will verify it's correct and (probably) accept it. Thank you very much!
      – user3533
      Apr 30 '12 at 20:34






    • 3




      In your SES of $mathbb{Z}G$-modules, the middle term is isomorphic to the direct sum of the other two as groups, but not as $mathbb{Z}G$-modules: $g$ acts trivially on the left and right copies of $mathbb{Z}$, but not on the middle $mathbb{Z}oplusmathbb{Z}$.
      – Julian Rosen
      Dec 8 '15 at 5:02








    • 4




      I don't think the last example is valid. You should study the split-ness of $0tomathbb Ztomathbb Zoplusmathbb Ztomathbb Zto0$ in the Abelian category of Abelian groups, not in the category of $mathbb ZG$-modules.
      – Frank Science
      Jul 2 '16 at 3:58










    • JulianRosen and FrankScience have explained why this example is wrong. My answer explains why it never had a chance to be right.
      – WillO
      Aug 9 '17 at 3:48


















    • I should add that there is a 1-1 correspondence between elements of $Ext^1(C,A)$ and short exact sequences $0 rightarrow A rightarrow B rightarrow C rightarrow 0$ and this sequence splits iff it corresponds to the $0$ element of the Ext group.
      – Parsa
      Apr 22 '12 at 22:50






    • 1




      This looks great, but I don't yet have the tools to understand it. When I do, I will verify it's correct and (probably) accept it. Thank you very much!
      – user3533
      Apr 30 '12 at 20:34






    • 3




      In your SES of $mathbb{Z}G$-modules, the middle term is isomorphic to the direct sum of the other two as groups, but not as $mathbb{Z}G$-modules: $g$ acts trivially on the left and right copies of $mathbb{Z}$, but not on the middle $mathbb{Z}oplusmathbb{Z}$.
      – Julian Rosen
      Dec 8 '15 at 5:02








    • 4




      I don't think the last example is valid. You should study the split-ness of $0tomathbb Ztomathbb Zoplusmathbb Ztomathbb Zto0$ in the Abelian category of Abelian groups, not in the category of $mathbb ZG$-modules.
      – Frank Science
      Jul 2 '16 at 3:58










    • JulianRosen and FrankScience have explained why this example is wrong. My answer explains why it never had a chance to be right.
      – WillO
      Aug 9 '17 at 3:48
















    I should add that there is a 1-1 correspondence between elements of $Ext^1(C,A)$ and short exact sequences $0 rightarrow A rightarrow B rightarrow C rightarrow 0$ and this sequence splits iff it corresponds to the $0$ element of the Ext group.
    – Parsa
    Apr 22 '12 at 22:50




    I should add that there is a 1-1 correspondence between elements of $Ext^1(C,A)$ and short exact sequences $0 rightarrow A rightarrow B rightarrow C rightarrow 0$ and this sequence splits iff it corresponds to the $0$ element of the Ext group.
    – Parsa
    Apr 22 '12 at 22:50




    1




    1




    This looks great, but I don't yet have the tools to understand it. When I do, I will verify it's correct and (probably) accept it. Thank you very much!
    – user3533
    Apr 30 '12 at 20:34




    This looks great, but I don't yet have the tools to understand it. When I do, I will verify it's correct and (probably) accept it. Thank you very much!
    – user3533
    Apr 30 '12 at 20:34




    3




    3




    In your SES of $mathbb{Z}G$-modules, the middle term is isomorphic to the direct sum of the other two as groups, but not as $mathbb{Z}G$-modules: $g$ acts trivially on the left and right copies of $mathbb{Z}$, but not on the middle $mathbb{Z}oplusmathbb{Z}$.
    – Julian Rosen
    Dec 8 '15 at 5:02






    In your SES of $mathbb{Z}G$-modules, the middle term is isomorphic to the direct sum of the other two as groups, but not as $mathbb{Z}G$-modules: $g$ acts trivially on the left and right copies of $mathbb{Z}$, but not on the middle $mathbb{Z}oplusmathbb{Z}$.
    – Julian Rosen
    Dec 8 '15 at 5:02






    4




    4




    I don't think the last example is valid. You should study the split-ness of $0tomathbb Ztomathbb Zoplusmathbb Ztomathbb Zto0$ in the Abelian category of Abelian groups, not in the category of $mathbb ZG$-modules.
    – Frank Science
    Jul 2 '16 at 3:58




    I don't think the last example is valid. You should study the split-ness of $0tomathbb Ztomathbb Zoplusmathbb Ztomathbb Zto0$ in the Abelian category of Abelian groups, not in the category of $mathbb ZG$-modules.
    – Frank Science
    Jul 2 '16 at 3:58












    JulianRosen and FrankScience have explained why this example is wrong. My answer explains why it never had a chance to be right.
    – WillO
    Aug 9 '17 at 3:48




    JulianRosen and FrankScience have explained why this example is wrong. My answer explains why it never had a chance to be right.
    – WillO
    Aug 9 '17 at 3:48











    0














    See the answer in this question:



    In R-Mod Category, example for $Bcong A oplus C nRightarrow 0 to A to B to C to0$ splits.



    It's similar to WillO's.






    share|cite|improve this answer




























      0














      See the answer in this question:



      In R-Mod Category, example for $Bcong A oplus C nRightarrow 0 to A to B to C to0$ splits.



      It's similar to WillO's.






      share|cite|improve this answer


























        0












        0








        0






        See the answer in this question:



        In R-Mod Category, example for $Bcong A oplus C nRightarrow 0 to A to B to C to0$ splits.



        It's similar to WillO's.






        share|cite|improve this answer














        See the answer in this question:



        In R-Mod Category, example for $Bcong A oplus C nRightarrow 0 to A to B to C to0$ splits.



        It's similar to WillO's.







        share|cite|improve this answer














        share|cite|improve this answer



        share|cite|improve this answer








        edited Dec 26 '18 at 21:29









        user26857

        39.2k123983




        39.2k123983










        answered Dec 25 '18 at 18:23









        Andrews

        384317




        384317






























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